Boss 5.0 Modular Block (iron)

[JPO8GT]

I currently have the block and i know i am good at this power level but i am not one to stop one day in the future i will be at a power level that you just cant go any further with the platform. This brings me to the question is there any one that has rashed and thrashed on a boss block enough to know what that limit is? I know this would probably be better to ask drag racers that's using this specific block. I am using all arp hardware including arp 2000 rod cap screws
I am currently shifting at 7000 rpm on race tune.

 

[GB10]

The block can handle a lot of power. If you want it to be nearly bulletproof (1500hp+) you could send it to Rich Groh at RGR for his billet main cap install which adds two more main studs per cap and a much better main cap like the 3v blocks have.

What rods will you be using? How much power do you anticipate?

 

[TurboX]

The block can handle a lot of power. If you want it to be nearly bulletproof (1500hp+) you could send it to Rich Groh at RGR for his billet main cap install which adds two more main studs per cap and a much better main cap like the 3v blocks have.

What rods will you be using? How much power do you anticipate?

Exactly what I did on my current build, last motor did show evidence on crank walking at 800RWHP. Previous motor not build by JPC.

http://www.musclemustangfastfords.c...ss_5l_block_and_stroker_upgrade/photo_03.html

 

[Department Of Boost]

Are you F'n kidding me! I'm just getting ready for a new build and was planning on using the BOSS block. But 4 bolt mains?!! And two of the four are "side bolts"?!!! May as well be a 2 bolt block. WTF Ford!

I never even thought to check if it had 6 bolt mains......like the STOCK BLOCK!!!

Am I looking at the right thing? Part # M-6010BOSS50

And how much does RGR charge for the billet main cap conversion?

I'm all bummed out now.

Maybe I will use one of the two perfectly good aluminum blocks that I have just sitting here, sigh.........I wanted the bigger bores of the BOSS block though.

last motor did show evidence on crank walking at 800RWHP

What block? The stock 3v aluminum one? Are you drag racing the car?

Thx

 

[JPO8GT]

Are you F'n kidding me! I'm just getting ready for a new build and was planning on using the BOSS block. But 4 bolt mains?!! And two of the four are "side bolts"?!!! May as well be a 2 bolt block. WTF Ford!

I never even thought to check if it had 6 bolt mains......like the STOCK BLOCK!!!

Am I looking at the right thing? Part # M-6010BOSS50

And how much does RGR charge for the billet main cap conversion?

I'm all bummed out now.

Maybe I will use one of the two perfectly good aluminum blocks that I have just sitting here, sigh.........I wanted the bigger bores of the BOSS block though.



What block? The stock 3v aluminum one? Are you drag racing the car?

Thx

Yes your right they come from ford with two bolt main cap and they have 2 pins instead of 2 additional bolts on cap side then the have 1 side bolt on each side of block/main caps i guess the side bolts are what ford is including when they call it 4 bolt main.
I would say technically its a 4 bolt main with pins but i didn't think side bolts we're counted as main bolts. Although they do bolt into each side of main caps and they most likely help with main cap stabability. I plan to push it to a solid repeatable1k rwhp first then i will see 1 k is my current goal which of course my goal was 800 rw now i am at 900 rw we will just have to see if i stop at 1000 rwhp.
If history repeats it self i wont stop lol.

 

[dysan]

When I lost my engine last year I asked Lito about going with the boss block and he steered me away from it for the same reasons already mentioned. So needless to say I went with another stock 3v aluminum block.

 

[Bobby]

It is a lot of money to do the billet mains.

 

[BruceH]

I wonder how close a set of 6 bolt main caps would be as in would the holes line up except for the two that aren't there? If that's the case then someone with a mill should be able to cut the missing block holes with a gun barrel bit using the main cap as a guide.

Main caps should be easy enough to find since they usually survive when the block doesn't.

 

[Department Of Boost]

Yes your right they come from ford with two bolt main cap and they have 2 pins instead of 2 additional bolts on cap side then the have 1 side bolt on each side of block/main caps i guess the side bolts are what ford is including when they call it 4 bolt main.
I would say technically its a 4 bolt main with pins but i didn't think side bolts we're counted as main bolts. Although they do bolt into each side of main caps and they most likely help with main cap stabability.

This is how the iron GT500 blocks are set up. I have one right here. When I pulled it down I was like WTF???? That's not what I would call a 4 bolt main. I would like to see a pic of the BOSS block/mains and see how they compare to the GT500 setup. The GT500's don't have block issues, if the BOSS is the same why would it be any different? Wishful thinking??

I plan to push it to a solid repeatable1k rwhp

Me too, but I wanted the bigger bore to unshroud the exhaust valve and the extra displacement so I could make more HP on pump (which I run most of the time). The BOSS block was the way to go there, but I want to rev it to 7,500+ on a regular basis too. I would feel better with beefy mains doing that.

When I lost my engine last year I asked Lito about going with the boss block and he steered me away from it for the same reasons already mentioned. So needless to say I went with another stock 3v aluminum block.

I would never discount Lito's advice. Add that to "fake" 4 bolt mains and I am thinking of using one of my stock blocks. It will be cheaper.....and ligher......

It is a lot of money to do the billet mains.

I would expect nothing less.

 

[Department Of Boost]

I just looked at that link better. The BOSS block doesn’t have the same pin arrangement that the GT500 has. I wish that link showed what the BOSS main caps looked like.

I just looked at that link better. The BOSS block doesn’t have the same pin arrangement that the GT500 has. I wish that link showed what the BOSS main caps looked like.

I’m not terribly confident that stock mains could be made to work. The outer two studs need to thread the needle between the inner studs and the pins in the block. If the stock mains are not in exactly the same spot, and the set I am looking at appear to have a wider bolt pattern, they won’t work no matter what you have for machines.

There is probably a reason RGR built mains from scratch opposed to modding stock ones.

Stupid Ford

 

[Department Of Boost]

These are GT500 mains. Yeah, amazing huh? A 2 bolt main and “pins” go where the arrows are. The other half of the “pins” hole is in the main caps. The side bolts go through the pins and into the mains. Good for 1100-1200hp and I don’t know how many RPM.

Can't do a "4 bolt" conversion on a GT500 block. No meat there.

 

[BruceH]

Pretty sure that's how the Romeo 4.6 iron block is set up too.

 

[Department Of Boost]

This was bugging me all night. I got up and found this pic of the BOSS block mains. I don’t see how the RGR 4 bolt conversion is happening without machining the block, which the article says they don’t. You can see the GT500 style pin bosses (pardon pun) in the BOSS block. But the RGR block doesn’t have them. Hmmmmmm. Am I missing something?

Stock BOSS block mains with spots for pins

RGR BOSS block. No provisions for pins.

This stock BOSS block is exactly like a GT500 block. They are good for 1200+hp no problem. Anyone know how fast some of these big shooters are spinning them?

BOSS block article copy:
http://www.mustang50magazine.com/techarticles/m5lp_0803_frpp_mustang_block/photo_04.html

 

[JPO8GT]

This was bugging me all night. I got up and found this pic of the BOSS block mains. I don’t see how the RGR 4 bolt conversion is happening without machining the block, which the article says they don’t. You can see the GT500 style pin bosses (pardon pun) in the BOSS block. But the RGR block doesn’t have them. Hmmmmmm. Am I missing something?

Stock BOSS block mains with spots for pins

RGR BOSS block. No provisions for pins.

This stock BOSS block is exactly like a GT500 block. They are good for 1200+hp no problem. Anyone know how fast some of these big shooters are spinning them?

BOSS block article copy:
http://www.mustang50magazine.com/techarticles/m5lp_0803_frpp_mustang_block/photo_04.html

I checked on the RGR conversion when i had my boss block built and Bob Kurgan spoke with Rich Grogh about it you do have to machine the block and you can order the rgr caps from jpc i was verbally given a estimate of around 2k$ additional for the conversion.
At that time i decided against due to my goals were 800 tire power.
If im not mistaken jpc / rgr are spinning them beyond 7500+ i have heard tells of up to 8k has been done with custom cams.
I plan to keep my rev limiter in the 72-7300 range shifting at 7000 rpm.
Thx for posting the artical Sutten states in the artical that they had no issues racing with the block as is from frpp1240 crank hp.
I think in stock main cap form this block should be able to handle solid 1000 tire power reliably and you can probably get away with more power if your not spinning it to the moon.
Soon enough i will know because I'm not tearing down my boss block to convert I'm just going to eventually push more air through and see what happens lol.

 

[Bob_Kurgan]

update your signture to reflect the new HP numbers jamie

 

[Department Of Boost]

08 GT Built 9.5CR 3 valve Novi 2200 8 rib STOCK Throttle Body, STOCK Water Pump, STOCK PCM STOCK IGNITION Kurgan Motorsports! 93 octane 13* total timing at peak. High 11s AFR 805.4 RWHP on 93 pump gas...on VP C-16 21* timing 896.03 RWHP FB 4R70W Auto trans dynojet..

Thread jack bitches!!

I see your running C16. I was thinking of picking some up and bumping the boost but noticed the other night at the track that it is leaded. What is this going to do to my o2's and wideband?

How much boost did you make 805hp on?

How much boost did you make 896hp on?

 

[BruceH]

This was bugging me all night. I got up and found this pic of the BOSS block mains. I don’t see how the RGR 4 bolt conversion is happening without machining the block, which the article says they don’t. You can see the GT500 style pin bosses (pardon pun) in the BOSS block. But the RGR block doesn’t have them. Hmmmmmm. Am I missing something?

Stock BOSS block mains with spots for pins

RGR BOSS block. No provisions for pins.

This stock BOSS block is exactly like a GT500 block. They are good for 1200+hp no problem. Anyone know how fast some of these big shooters are spinning them?

BOSS block article copy:
http://www.mustang50magazine.com/techarticles/m5lp_0803_frpp_mustang_block/photo_04.html

They machined the block a little more common to the main caps. The new stud hole has zero edge or radius margin in the first step. It doesn't look like there is enough meat on the block to maintain much margin below the step.

I'm not an engineer but I do have knowledge of structure. Especially what holes and their margins will do strength wise. I'd rather have the stock block with the jack screws than the conversion. IMO there isn't enough structure there to make much difference in strength and the extra holes don't have enough material around them to absorb the loads that will be exerted. I'd believe they would crack out over time.

The only way to know for sure would be testing, teardown, and inspection. Does anyone know what the longevity of the conversion is?

Before anyone gets in an uproar realize that I'm going off of the pictures, actual measurements might indicate something different. IMO that conversion does little to nothing to add strength. A smaller fastener with more material margin would be stronger imo.

 

[Department Of Boost]

They machined the block a little more common to the main caps. The new stud hole has zero edge or radius margin in the first step. It doesn't look like there is enough meat on the block to maintain much margin below the step.

I'm not an engineer but I do have knowledge of structure. Especially what holes and their margins will do strength wise. I'd rather have the stock block with the jack screws than the conversion. IMO there isn't enough structure there to make much difference in strength and the extra holes don't have enough material around them to absorb the loads that will be exerted. I'd believe they would crack out over time.

The only way to know for sure would be testing, teardown, and inspection. Does anyone know what the longevity of the conversion is?

Before anyone gets in an uproar realize that I'm going off of the pictures, actual measurements might indicate something different. IMO that conversion does little to nothing to add strength. A smaller fastener with more material margin would be stronger imo.

I agree, it looks a little sketchy here-ish (pic). IDK though, could be no big deal. Just sayin'

 

[crownaviation]

Thread jack bitches!!

I see your running C16. I was thinking of picking some up and bumping the boost but noticed the other night at the track that it is leaded. What is this going to do to my o2's and wideband?
?

It will eventually kill the 02's. I ran probably 50+ gallons thru mine before I ruined a 02 sensor (why I eventually swapped to e85). Maybe I was un-lucky dunno, but they were also high miles (55k) sensors too.

I know you do not have cats but it will kill those as well.

Great fuel tho, that and the q16 but that gets pricey ($16/gallon here for the q16).

I can get "true" e85 (race fuel) here for $4/gal. Regular pump e85 (70-79 seasonally) for $2.18/gal. The pump is good for 23* of timing on the 70. Get nuts on the race 85 lol.

But.. with the 4.10's I now get literally 10-12 mpg at 65 mph on the highway. That is the absolute best I can get at a highway speed

 

[ethic1]

I wonder if some of the none JPC cars even have this? I wonder if Vinny has the conversion? That's the real question is what do the fast guys have....