Boss 5.0 Modular Block (iron)

[BruceH]

I agree, it looks a little sketchy here-ish (pic). IDK though, could be no big deal. Just sayin'

A good rule of thumb is to have 3x the hole diameter for material (including the hole or 1.5x fastener diameter from the center of the hole) at a minimum with billet material. Don't know about cast. Also don't know what the stress numbers are in this situation. It would take a team of engineers about 3 days of number crunching to get an answer that was better than a guess. I'd say Ford cast the extra material around the main holes for a reason. The new holes start out with enough material in the 1st step except for the bad edge margin but it looks like the material isn't there for long. A measurment of the block is the only way to know for sure.

 

[JPO8GT]

I have also been curious if a deep cryogenic treatment of the block would have any real benefit.
Something else we will never know till tested.

 

[JPO8GT]

Thread jack bitches!!

I see your running C16. I was thinking of picking some up and bumping the boost but noticed the other night at the track that it is leaded. What is this going to do to my o2's and wideband?

How much boost did you make 805hp on?

How much boost did you make 896hp on?

93+meth18 psi = 805
C16 22 psi = 900.07 new number after Bob adjusted fuel pressure last week also picked up 30+ rwtq.
I will update my sig with new numbers when i log into pc stupid phone with taptalk won't let me edit signature.

 

[YoungPony]

Chevykiller's last engine was assembled by RGR and had the billet main caps. As far as I know they never tore it down after numerous 8 second passes. So can't comment on any stress in the places that Bruce was pointing out. Ed (silverposion) can maybe chime in about it or ask Greg at RET about it.

 

[Department Of Boost]

93+meth18 psi = 805
C16 22 psi = 900.07 new number after Bob adjusted fuel pressure last week also picked up 30+ rwtq.
I will update my sig with new numbers when i log into pc stupid phone with taptalk won't let me edit signature.

So 930rwhp through an auto on C16 at 22psi?

I may be looking good on C16 then. I'm not thrilled with running leaded fuel though. I have 106 unleaded from the pump near me. I may start there and see how much boost I can get away with.

I'm tempted from time to time to switch to e85 but I don't want to go through my fuel system.....again!

Stupid cars

 

[crownaviation]

E85 is nice redneck fuel for the money but will never be as good as some of the real race fuel.

Just pullley n tune on pump for the 700+ and have a pulley and race fuel for the track. Pita yes but best of both worlds.

 

[JPO8GT]

E85 is nice redneck fuel for the money but will never be as good as some of the real race fuel.

Just pulley n tune on pump for the 700+ and have a pulley and race fuel for the track. Pita yes but best of both worlds.

Three reasons i dident go e85 #1 closest e85 station 50 miles away #2 e85 tends to be on dirty side causing more maint on fuel system, filters don't last as long and more potential for clogged injector.
#3 fuel economy isn't good on a high power car.. e85 makes it worse.
The aem meth kit helps my car make the power on 93 and it uses my windshield wiper fluid reservoir it has a controller only sprays when boost comes on and as boost climbs it progressively sprays more when cruising its not spraying so 1 gallon in reservoir last a good while.

 

[ethic1]

I would think there are plenty of people out there with other than 3v as well that are making 1000whp+ with out the 4 bolt main upgrade.....

 

[crownaviation]

I would think there are plenty of people out there with other than 3v as well that are making 1000whp+ with out the 4 bolt main upgrade.....

Not sure there are but maybe a few 3v's making that much power.

That pic of the caps is crazy. Never would have thought they would do that on a block they know people are going to be pushing hard.

 

[TurboX]

As I posted, at 800RWHP there was evidence of the crank walking and main caps chattering. This was only revving to 6500ish and less than 20psi.

Some people drink wine out of a bottle and others prefer a box.

A goal for my car is the Texas Mile and all my runs are longer than a 1/4 mile, this and the failures of last motor led me to invest in the upgrade.

Bruce, I remember the original Romeo blocks were 2 top bolts and 2 side bolts, in 99 the Windsor motors had 2 top bolts,2 plugs and 2 side bolts. The Aluminum blocks may vary, Im just listing what I know about the iron. I will add some pictures of my main caps and support later this week when I go to work on car.

 

[Department Of Boost]

As I posted, at 800RWHP there was evidence of the crank walking and main caps chattering. This was only revving to 6500ish and less than 20psi.

With the BOSS block?

Were you also drag racing this car? Hard launches? Sub 1.5 60ft times? What sort of trans?

 

[TurboX]

With the BOSS block?

Were you also drag racing this car? Hard launches? Sub 1.5 60ft times? What sort of trans?

Yes a Boss block, Zero Hard Launches(Best 60ft 1.92 on DRs)Blue printed TR6060. Best track time was a 11.9@143, as I said it a street car. I do Vbox type stuff and long high speed runs.


Here are some photos, sorry the files are so big.

 

[Department Of Boost]

Yes a Boss block, Zero Hard Launches(Best 60ft 1.92 on DRs)Blue printed TR6060. Best track time was a 11.9@143, as I said it a street car. I do Vbox type stuff and long high speed runs.


Here are some photos, sorry the files are so big.

So with the "4 bolt" BOSS block the crank was walking around? Then you did the RGR conversion?

 

[TurboX]

So with the "4 bolt" BOSS block the crank was walking around? Then you did the RGR conversion?

With whatever was stock on the Boss block I experienced issues, Entire new shortblock from JPC to hopefully avoid same problems.

 

[Department Of Boost]

With whatever was stock on the Boss block I experienced issues, Entire new shortblock from JPC to hopefully avoid same problems.

That BOSS block is starting to scare me. I will probably use a stock aluminum block.

Anyone know how fast you can spin a 3v valvetrain before it starts breaking/spitting parts out? I would like to go to 7,500-8,000rpm with it.

 

[Dark_horse]

I will be finding out soon enough on this topic... Pistons should be delivered in 2 weeks then off to the machine shop

 

[BruceH]

Can the Cammer block hold big power? It's aluminum with knock sensors but costs a bit of money.

What about the Darton sleeve conversion? Does it hold big power?

Buzz, do you have any pics of the crankwalk? I'd imagine you see it in the bearings or thrust washer but don't really know for sure, it would be good to have a mental reference.

Part Details

Hover over image to zoom
click to enlarge




5.0L ALUMINUM CYLINDER BLOCK - ROAD RACE APPLICATIONS
M-6010-T50*
Suggested Retail Price
$4,299.00

Sold in Units of:
Each (1)


tech notes

• The "Cammer" 5.0L block is the foundation of Ford Racing's road racing success. Competing in both Grand-Am's Daytona Prototype and the FIA GT class.
• Used in the FR500C Competition Mustangs
• Engineered and optimized to be the ideal road race modular block
• Race proven revised water jackets and between bore cross drilling for improved engine cooling.
• Designed for minimal weight while retaining strength and durability for naturally aspirated engine combinations
• Big bore 4.6L aluminum block with cast iron liners
• 94mm (3.70") cylinder bore size. Stock cylinder bore size 90.2mm (3.552")
• 227mm (8.9370") deck height (same as 4.6L)
• Produces 5.0L displacement when used with a 4.6L stock stroke crankshaft, stock length connecting rods and custom 94mm-diameter pistons.
• Cross bolted main bearing caps
• Requires water pump YR3Z-8501-AB/Motorcraft PW-402 long 87mm (3.425) pump or YW7Z-8501-BB/Motorcraft PW-409 short 65mm (2.559) pump.
• No provision for heater return or thermostat bypass
• Replacement sleeve M-6055-B

specs

Package Dimensions:
13 x 14.75 x 21.25

Package Weight:
97 lbs

Part Type:
Engine: Engine Blocks

Instruction Sheet:
Not Available

Warranty Availability:
Not Available

Country of Origin:
United States

UPC Code:
756122063156

 

[JPO8GT]

That BOSS block is starting to scare me. I will probably use a stock aluminum block.

Anyone know how fast you can spin a 3v valvetrain before it starts breaking/spitting parts out? I would like to go to 7,500-8,000rpm with it.

this is strange that these issues happened on a street only AP i would question the builders quality control on the first short block sounds like this was built at 5:00 on a Friday. Not that this couldn't happen but no hard drag tire launches street tires it don't add up when stock 4.6 and 5.4s are not having this issues and many have on drag tires & running faster time with all stock tty fastners (not ARP) i call this one a total lemon scenario. That would suck to think you have BOSS strength and this happen hope this doesn't happen to anyone else.

As far as stock 3valve block it would probably be fine spun that hard and i believe staying stock stroke should be better for high revs and it should have less piston to wall drag. Good rotating assy arp hardware, valve springs, lockouts, right cams & intake good to go

 

[TurboX]

i call this one a total lemon scenario. That would suck to think you have BOSS strength and this happen hope this doesn't happen to anyone else.

I thought and hope it was, I shipped the entire shortblock to a different well known builder for inspection. He could not determine what caused it and also could not promise I wouldnt see the same thing if I bought a motor from him. He did mention that he had seen it happen and it happens in high HP applications. The walking crank was only part of the problem, I broke the crank and my timing system had a catastrophic failure. Luckily, I was pulling the heads to send them to be ported when 1 thing led to another.

I happen to be googling and ran across the MMFF link I posted. I called JPC and spoke to Eric, he told me they had seen it before as well and this was the solution. Was it a sales pitch ? Dont know but Im not willing to take a chance and bought into the Billet main cap theory.

 

[BruceH]

I thought and hope it was, I shipped the entire shortblock to a different well known builder for inspection. He could not determine what caused it and also could not promise I wouldnt see the same thing if I bought a motor from him. He did mention that he had seen it happen and it happens in high HP applications. The walking crank was only part of the problem, I broke the crank and my timing system had a catastrophic failure. Luckily, I was pulling the heads to send them to be ported when 1 thing led to another.

I happen to be googling and ran across the MMFF link I posted. I called JPC and spoke to Eric, he told me they had seen it before as well and this was the solution. Was it a sales pitch ? Dont know but Im not willing to take a chance and bought into the Billet main cap theory.

What kind of crank broke? How much is the billet conversion with the block?