My NSR cam choices..

[Redrocket06]

Been a while since I chimmed in, but I need some direction.

Here's the deal.
I have JLT CAI, UDP, LT with 1.5" primaries, OR/H, SCT3. My best times at the track are 12.68@108, [email protected], and best [email protected] all on DR's, 3.55 gears and manual 5 speed.

I have been looking at NSR cams. I have narrowed it down to 2.

BBR Stage 1SOHC Great Street / Strip Performance cam with Noticable Idle. Recomend lower gears, Computer Programming Required, and 2300+ stall for automatics. RPM Range 1500-6000. 227/233 .050" duration, .480/.480 lift, 114 LSA. Recommend Replacing Valve Spring.
Gross Lift Intake- .480, Exhaust- .480
Advertised Duration Intake- 270°, Exhaust- 276°

and

Comp NSR Stage 2
Lift: .450, .450
Seat Duration: 261, 278
0.050 Duration: 222, 235
Lobe Seperation: 115.5


I will be getting one of these 2 in April, along with LCA and UCA, not any others, not thumpers, not hot rods, not SPR, or VSR........ Lots of info on Comp, but little on BBR. Is anybody here running the BBR Stage 1? I talked to BBR today, and he said .3-.4 tenths gain in the 1/4, slight loss of low end tq. Comp claimed the same .3-.4 gain when I talked to them. BBR has that lope sound, but sound doesn't get you down the track faster. Anybody have any track time with BBR stage 1's or dyno sheet to show a curve (similar mods to mine of course)?

Plus they said the BBR's run better with lockouts. Can somebody better explain the installation better than the little rightups the sellers post. Does the small block just slip in the factory VCT?

sorry, long.

 

[US-1]

Do you plan to run more gear anytime soon? Based on your current combination I'd go with the Comps and no lockouts or limiters.

 

[Redrocket06]

What kind of negatives will I have with 3.55 and the BBR Stage 1?

 

[rojizostang]

pretty good times for the mods you've got. not to jack your thread. how are you leaving the line with that gear and tire without bogging? you must be a master at slipping the clutch just right.

i guess you must have the driver mod.

 

[US-1]

What kind of negatives will I have with 3.55 and the BBR Stage 1?

None really. I would use the Comps due to no limiters or lockouts being required. Plus, the cam looks to be more tractable during normal street driving with the shorter intake duration.

 

[killrb]

I put the Comp stage 2 NSR cams in along with long tube headers and delete plates. Combined, all those parts made an additional 41 rwhp. Sorry I don't have numbers for the cams alone.

Brenspeed.com has some numbers showing about 27 peak rwhp and 21 rwhp across the board with just those cams. Sounds about right.

Brandon

 

[GERMANSHEPERD]

Personally i wouldnt do a NSR cam. Do a SPR cam and get the power out of a cam swap, and yes Virginia you need a gear-technically you need a gear now.

 

[Redrocket06]

pretty good times for the mods you've got. not to jack your thread. how are you leaving the line with that gear and tire without bogging? you must be a master at slipping the clutch just right.

i guess you must have the driver mod.

I launch at around 45/4600 rpm and slip the clutch. I do drive better than some, but no master here. And on that 12.56 run she did bog slightly and I spun 2nd when I shifted.

 

[Redrocket06]

None really. I would use the Comps due to no limiters or lockouts being required. Plus, the cam looks to be more tractable during normal street driving with the shorter intake duration.

How much tq loss would be expected. I can live with drivability issues down low, as long as it makes up for it up high. Would the BBR stage 1 out shine the NSR stage 2 in the topend?

 

[*JZ*]

You were asking about the Lockouts.

We always recommend the lockouts, b/c the VCT is a weak part of the valve train. We have seen the VCT break with stock cams... They are capable of being tuned with, but difficult being that the VCT flucuates and is not the same twice in a row. With the Lockouts you can either fully advance the VCT and lock it out or fully retard the VCT and lock it out. There for you can also optimize either your torque gains for your overall horsepower gains in doing this.


Stock VCT and VCT limiters are NOT the way to go.

 

[marcspaz]

What kind of negatives will I have with 3.55 and the BBR Stage 1?

The gears play a role in low-end rpm's and drivability. You will have to rev the engine a lot high to get the car moving without bogging, bucking, chattering, etc. Also, at the track they are killing your 330' times.

I have the Comp NSR cams and 4.56:1 gears. I need to get some new ET's listed this year, as my sig numbers are from before the LT's and cams. I can tell you that I cut my 60' by .26 seconds, but I have had pretty bad luck at the track this year. Blew the clutch the first day out and the rear the second day out. I can let you know what happens Wednesday, barring any other failures.

Personally i wouldnt do a NSR cam. Do a SPR cam and get the power out of a cam swap, and yes Virginia you need a gear-technically you need a gear now.

I would have to agree. I have had my NSR's for less than 8 months and I am already upgrading.

Either way, both cams are good. I like the idea of locking out the VCT too.

 

[DKO]

I thought the VCT is what made the 3V run so well. From what I gathered it just produced a lot more midrange that really helped the car take off compared to some 4V cars out there. There's a lot of conflicting information out there on what is better between locking out the VCT or just installing phasers. I'm really torn here as I plan on doing cams eventually too. Seems like everytime someone convinces me that one way is better, someone else makes me believe the opposite again.

Can someone put up some real facts here, like some dyno sheets to back up the claims?

I'd also like to do some 'REAL' cams that will really add some bang to my buck by going with the VSR style or BBRs, but what's the process like with changing out the valve springs? I've been told 'it's a bitch', but could someone elaborate a bit more? I've done Valve springs on an LS1 and it really wasn't that bad.

 

[GERMANSHEPERD]

The gears play a role in low-end rpm's and drivability. You will have to rev the engine a lot high to get the car moving without bogging, bucking, chattering, etc. Also, at the track they are killing your 330' times.

I have the Comp NSR cams and 4.56:1 gears. I need to get some new ET's listed this year, as my sig numbers are from before the LT's and cams. I can tell you that I cut my 60' by .26 seconds, but I have had pretty bad luck at the track this year. Blew the clutch the first day out and the rear the second day out. I can let you know what happens Wednesday, barring any other failures.



I would have to agree. I have had my NSR's for less than 8 months and I am already upgrading.

Either way, both cams are good. I like the idea of locking out the VCT too.

Damn cutting your 60' by .26 is amazing....half a second at the end of the track right there.

 

[marcspaz]

Damn cutting your 60' by .26 is amazing....half a second at the end of the track right there.

Hell yea man. I wish the rear didn't let go on my very first pass. I know there is a 12.5 / 12.4 in her.

If the heads don't go in this week, I will get some 1/4 mile ET's on Saturday. If I do get the heads, I will be installing them on Saturday instead.

I thought the VCT is what made the 3V run so well. From what I gathered it just produced a lot more midrange that really helped the car take off compared to some 4V cars out there. There's a lot of conflicting information out there on what is better between locking out the VCT or just installing phasers. I'm really torn here as I plan on doing cams eventually too. Seems like everytime someone convinces me that one way is better, someone else makes me believe the opposite again.

Can someone put up some real facts here, like some dyno sheets to back up the claims?

I'd also like to do some 'REAL' cams that will really add some bang to my buck by going with the VSR style or BBRs, but what's the process like with changing out the valve springs? I've been told 'it's a bitch', but could someone elaborate a bit more? I've done Valve springs on an LS1 and it really wasn't that bad.

Dude, you sound a bit frustrated.

The VCT is more of an emissions solution than a performance enhancement. With adding my Comp Cam Stage 2 NSR's (no lockouts or limiters) and LT Headers, my TQ and HP was unchanged from 2k-4k. From 4500 rpm's to 7000 rpm's, I saw gains of 30-32 RWHP and RWTQ.

An NSR cam swap is pretty easy on these engines for a good DIY guy, but springs are a completely diff story.

If you are doing them yourself, get the comp cams and skip the lockouts.

If you know how to degree an engine, get the BBR's and lockouts.

If you have deep pockets or you are a auto tech, get ported heads, upgraded valves and springs, lockouts, and the biggest custom grind cams the new heads will take.

Regardless of whether you choose Comp or BBR, you are going to get a great product.

I am not going to be able to give you a before and after with the new cams and lock outs because I am doing heads at the same time.

 

[US-1]

....but what's the process like with changing out the valve springs? I've been told 'it's a bitch', but could someone elaborate a bit more? I've done Valve springs on an LS1 and it really wasn't that bad.

It goes well beyond the "it's a bitch" category.

 

[rojizostang]

pm hufen, he just changed the springs on his car, and did the job himself. he can probably help you out.

 

[Redrocket06]

You were asking about the Lockouts.

We always recommend the lockouts, b/c the VCT is a weak part of the valve train. We have seen the VCT break with stock cams... They are capable of being tuned with, but difficult being that the VCT flucuates and is not the same twice in a row. With the Lockouts you can either fully advance the VCT and lock it out or fully retard the VCT and lock it out. There for you can also optimize either your torque gains for your overall horsepower gains in doing this.


Stock VCT and VCT limiters are NOT the way to go.

Do you have to degree the cams when you install the lockout? Or do they just slip in?
Also, have ya'll installed the Stage 1's on a car with 3.55's? How was the drivability and would you say the topend make up for any loss down low? I don't might a quarky lowend as long as it shines like a diamond up top.

 

[*JZ*]

Do you have to degree the cams when you install the lockout? Or do they just slip in?
Also, have ya'll installed the Stage 1's on a car with 3.55's? How was the drivability and would you say the topend make up for any loss down low? I don't might a quarky lowend as long as it shines like a diamond up top.

We have installed them in both cars with 3.31'sin autos as well as 3.55's in manuals.

As for the VCT Lockouts. There is only 2 ways to install them. You either set the VCT in the fully advanced possition or in the fully retarded possition... They slip right in.

 

[Redrocket06]

We have installed them in both cars with 3.31'sin autos as well as 3.55's in manuals.

As for the VCT Lockouts. There is only 2 ways to install them. You either set the VCT in the fully advanced possition or in the fully retarded possition... They slip right in.

Awsome! Also when I order you will tell me which side to put them in to advance or retard it, right?
Plus I think your regrinds use shims, do your billet stage 1's use shims too?

Man I wish my tax return was here already!!

 

[*JZ*]

Awsome! Also when I order you will tell me which side to put them in to advance or retard it, right?
Plus I think your regrinds use shims, do your billet stage 1's use shims too?

Man I wish my tax return was here already!!

regrinds require shims. billets do not.