What am I doing wrong???

[Grey Ghost]

So I read all of these posts about how many of you in 2011+ GTs are able to pull consistent mid to upper 12 sec qtr mile times in stock form. I see a lot of "went to the track today, pulled a 12.5 to a 12.9 in the qtr mile bone stock with street tires." like it was no big deal and I can't seem to achieve all of these great times myself. Here's my scenario:

Frst time at the track in my 6-spd '11 GT, completely stock down to the street tires (18" stock mustang wheels and tires), the best I could pull was a 13.1 @ 110mph in the qtr mile. It was in Aug 2013 and probably about 85 degrees that night. Here's my time slip broken down below for analysis:

r/t - .589
60' - 2.158
330' - 5.765
1/8 - 8.659
MPH - 85.70
1000 - 11.127
1/4 - 13.187
MPH - 110.11

The above best time btw, was a pain in ass to achieve. Most of the runs were in the upper 13s to lower 14s, which was pathetic knowing what these cars are capable of. Of course I could barely get traction, which I know is a huge part of the problem, but my goal was to get the quickest time possible in complete stock form.

Now fast forward, I recently went to the track for the second time this past weekend, but this time I had a Airaid CAI with a Bama 93 Race Tune to see if I could improve upon my stock qtr mile time given that I increased my horsepower. To be honest, driving around with Bama's 93 tune, I couldn't really feel a whole difference in power from the butt dyno, but figured the track would tell me a difference.

So anyways, went to track, had horrible traction issues, spinning in 1st and 2nd gears, and was missing shifts from 1st to 2nd and then from 2nd to 3rd on occasions. The best time I could that night was a 13.2 @ 112mph, which was worse then when I was stock! Keep in mind, I also switched to my 19"x10" Saleen Heritage wheels in back with very worn street tires, but didn't think this would affect much. Also, in case this matters, it was about 53 degrees that night. Again, most of times were mid to upper 13secs, pathetic. Here's the full time slip below of my best time that night again for analysis:

r/t - .551
60' - 2.297
330 - 5.989
1/8 - 8.803
MPH - 87.45
1000 - 11.213
1/4 - 13.225
MPH - 112.63

Okay, so what the fuck am I doing wrong that I can't achieve the times everyone seems to so easily achieve or at the very least improve my time from when I was stock?

Besides the obvious of switching from street tires to slicks or radials, what else can be done? If you guys could lay out all the scenarios that I should or could be doing to get better times, PLEASE LET ME KNOW. It's getting really frustrating knowing the car should be capable of more or apparently I just suck at drag racing.

Welcome the feedback

 

[Renesis07]

FWIW the 2mph increase in the second time shows your car is indeed making more power. Any idea what the DA was at the track for both days?

If you look at your time slips your 60' time in the second one was worse than the first, that's probably the culprit for the slower ET

ET = Driver Mod
MPH = Power

More seat time and I'm sure you'll get closer to your goals, just have fun.

 

[skwerl]

When your track doesn't bother spending the time or money to prep the track surface, there's not much you can do except spend a lot of money to buy traction. When I was starting out with my Bullitt, my local track had been owned by the same old codger for 30 years and he was actively looking to sell it or close it down. The track was awful and it took me a lot of time and money to learn how to launch there. The positive side of that was when I went to other tracks with better prep, my car was already set up to take advantage of it.

On street tires you're not going to do much unless you happen to catch a night with decent prep on the track. Lower your rear tire pressure slightly (about 22-25 lbs), avoid the water box, do a light burnout to clean off the tires and try to launch without spinning too much.

 

[FIVE-OH]

I know about eleven guys with new 5.0's. Only two got in the 12's bone stock. Most were in the low 13's. Granted our DA isn't usually the best.

I have never seen a bone stock 5.0 run a mid 12, people can say whaever they want on the internet. Not saying it's impossible, but I have never seen it, or heard about one.

I also say lose that terd Bama tune. Maybe get some LCA's...with practice you will be in the 12's!

 

[Renesis07]

I know about eleven guys with new 5.0's. Only two got in the 12's bone stock. Most were in the low 13's. Granted our DA isn't usually the best.

I have never seen a bone stock 5.0 run a mid 12, people can say whaever they want on the internet. Not saying it's impossible, but I have never seen it, or heard about one.

I only know of maybe one or two confirmed people that ran HIGH 12's bone stock. Seems like the rest are hero runs and/or people not in my area. Most are 13.0-13.3 it seems in stock trim.

Also, sometimes you have to clarify BONE STOCK with these internet claims, because they may have used a tire to hit mid-high 12's stock.

 

[FIVE-OH]

FYI, my former '11 MT-82 ran a best of 12.9 bone stock in 200 DA.
My current '11 6R80 ran a best of 13.1 bone stock in 2100 DA.

Never ran it again stock in good DA as I swapped the axle back and tuned it before I went back...and picked up over five tenths.

 

[Grabber Blue 5.0]

One problem with the Bama tune is torque management isn't turned off so that's not going to help track times. I say get a better tune.

 

[AlbertD]

DA plays a huge factor in your time compared to others on the site. Most 5.0s (yes, even some modded ones) here in Tucson run 14s all day long. Our DA is 5800+

If you want to compare times, focus on comparing with others in your area. Alot of those "great" times discussed on the site were done in an optimal DA type environment.

 

[dysan]

FWIW the 2mph increase in the second time shows your car is indeed making more power. Any idea what the DA was at the track for both days?

If you look at your time slips your 60' time in the second one was worse than the first, that's probably the culprit for the slower ET

ET = Driver Mod
MPH = Power

More seat time and I'm sure you'll get closer to your goals, just have fun.

Actually the extra mph is more of an indication of more tire spin on the launch and possibly on shifts during the run.

Of you look at the 60' on the faster mph you will see a worse launch.

 

[2011/5.0]

I just ran in our best da this year+860 to+950 compared to +2000 and picked up 2-3 mph and a good .1 50* air temp ,da is huge on your 1/4 et

 

[psfracer]

I also switched to my 19"x10" Saleen Heritage wheels in back with very worn street tires, but didn't think this would affect much. Also, in case this matters, it was about 53 degrees that night. Again, most of times were mid to upper 13secs, pathetic.

Come here.

DA will make a big difference as mentioned above (especially N/A) and could be responsible for the 2 mph increase at both the 1/8th and the 1/4. And with more power your self inflicted traction woes became worse.

Your 2 mph gain is already at the 1/8th, and you have the typical 25 mph gain from the 1/8th to the 1/4, so the car is definitely capable of 12s.

What is the weight difference from your stock 18s to your aftermarket 19 inch wheels?

 

[Grey Ghost]

Thanks for all the feedback so far! This is why I ask you guys because you guys all know your shit! Good stuff! Unfortunately, I'm still a bit of drag strip novice despite having done over 30+ runs over the years in my cars. I never really paid much attention to the DA or knew much about it. Sounds like that might be part of my problem. As far as what the DA was both of those nights, I'm not sure. The track is Gateway Motorsports Park outside of St. Louis, MO, which has a Track elevation of 390.4 ft. I know the air temps those nights, but that's about it. Any way to guess the DA then?

When your track doesn't bother spending the time or money to prep the track surface, there's not much you can do except spend a lot of money to buy traction. When I was starting out with my Bullitt, my local track had been owned by the same old codger for 30 years and he was actively looking to sell it or close it down. The track was awful and it took me a lot of time and money to learn how to launch there. The positive side of that was when I went to other tracks with better prep, my car was already set up to take advantage of it.

On street tires you're not going to do much unless you happen to catch a night with decent prep on the track. Lower your rear tire pressure slightly (about 22-25 lbs), avoid the water box, do a light burnout to clean off the tires and try to

I'm beginning to think this is bigger problem than I thought. I've heard from others who race at Gateway that their track prep is terrible, almost like they probably don't prep it at all. How can you tell if it's prepped?

I know about eleven guys with new 5.0's. Only two got in the 12's bone stock. Most were in the low 13's. Granted our DA isn't usually the best.

I have never seen a bone stock 5.0 run a mid 12, people can say whaever they want on the internet. Not saying it's impossible, but I have never seen it, or heard about one.

I also say lose that terd Bama tune. Maybe get some LCA's...with practice you will be in the 12's!

Yeah, the funny thing is most of the stock or lightly modded 5.0s that night were hitting around the same times. Would LCA's really help or do they only really help with wheel hop? Because wheel hop hasn't been an issue lately

One problem with the Bama tune is torque management isn't turned off so that's not going to help track times. I say get a better tune.

Pardon my lack of tune knowledge, but why isn't the torque management turned off with Bama's tune and what does this do for our cars?

Come here.

DA will make a big difference as mentioned above (especially N/A) and could be responsible for the 2 mph increase at both the 1/8th and the 1/4. And with more power your self inflicted traction woes became worse.

Your 2 mph gain is already at the 1/8th, and you have the typical 25 mph gain from the 1/8th to the 1/4, so the car is definitely capable of 12s.

What is the weight difference from your stock 18s to your aftermarket 19 inch wheels?

Well, I weighed the 19" Saleen Heritage wheels once before, but can't remember what they weigh. They are definitely heavier than the stock wheels, but would that make that much of a difference?

Also, just a question to everyone in general. How would I found out what the DA is for the day before I run my car? I would assume there isn't a good way to forecast which track days are going to have a better DA than others?

Another question, what RPM would you guys recommend launching at? or does it really matter, since I'm not getting traction? and should I consider launching in 2nd gear vs. 1st?

Keep the feedback coming, love it!

 

[Renesis07]

Really dumb question but no one asked... did you fully disable traction control? Ie hold down button for 7 seconds.

 

[Grey Ghost]

Really dumb question but no one asked... did you fully disable traction control? Ie hold down button for 7 seconds.

I did disable it

 

[JLear]

In my opinion you need sticky tires, your 12 second pass would come easily if you get the 60' down. As others have said da also plays a big part, my car ran 13.4 on street tires (27" tall) the day I bought it in 3500ish da, a few weeks later with 28" tall et streets and a very similar 60' it went 12.95 in 2500ish da.

 

[Boaisy]

When I was stock, I was able to run 12.9's at Memphis (2.0s 60', DA unknown), but that was between 65-70 degree weather and fairly new Bridgestone RE960AS's. If it was 70+ on stock, it was low 13's no matter how hard I tried. Mind you I have yet to break below 2.0s on my 60'. It is possible, but you need favorable conditions to get to the 12's.

Drag Times has an app (even for mobiles) to calculate the DA:

http://www.dragtimes.com/da-density...set=29.88&rh=79&submitButtonName=Calculate+DA

After elevation, the rest is basically gathered from local weather information. I'm sure there are probably better apps on the Android and iPhone market as well.

 

[Grabber Blue 5.0]

Pardon my lack of tune knowledge, but why isn't the torque management turned off with Bama's tune and what does this do for our cars?

Torque management/clutch protection. Bama doesn't know how to turn it off.

 

[Grey Ghost]

Interesting. So I take it most of the other tuners no how to do this? I would this feature keeps from tuners from increasing the torque, which could break the clutch??

 

[marcspaz]

Mike... I don't know anyone personally who ran better than a 12.9 on stock street tires. The best mine did was a 13.1. Added DR's and a tune and ran a 12.5. Most of my improvement was my 60' going from 2.2 to a 1.7. I have seen guys make sub-12.5 numbers with minimal mods and sticky tires though.

I would get a set of 28" MT DR's and a better tune and you can be in the sub-12.5 range with some practice.

 

[DeepimpactGTCS]

You're 60' is horrible. Fix that and you fix your issue