YSI-B Upgrade Pic Heavy

[Wild White Pony]

End of last year I decided to switch out to a better Centri Blower, the Vortech v3 Si was just at it limits of 18# and out of breath. Since November I have been adding supporting mods before I purchased the unit, including ID1000 injectors, S&H Hat to Rail fuel line upgrade, Fore fuel rails, KB 20vBap, Second Meth Jet and a custom 3.5"Inter Cooler piping setup with a custom Inter Cooler from S&H Performance that has the maf housing built in and a remote IAT sensor in the Intake Manifold so I can read the air with meth.

Well after waiting for a month my YSI-B showed up on Wednesday, had it ready to tune on Thursday.

I'm loading this with pics if anyone is interested in doing the same upgrade. I was just tired of the original 3" vortech setup and constant tuning problems having the maf located in the intake pipe before the TB. The new Radiator support for the Inte rcooler eliminated the original radiator support and freed up a ton of room.

This is a really easy install and inexpensive to boot, I think I have about $850.00 in it right now for the inter cooler,silicone couplers, clamps, Remote IAT sensor and piping. The BV and mounting flange I took from the original 3" pipe.

Original V3 setup.

New setup:
Old Rad Suport vs new support with Swaybar mounts

S&H Performance Inter Cooler and Mounting Support

3,5" Inter Cooler with Maf flang and original Vortech AA Inter Cooler

Tial Q50 BV

Sway Bar Mount, Plenty of clearance

Blower down pipe clearance.

Intake up pipe clearance, no problem with the A/C or Tensioner

Inter Cooler Support

Remote IAT Sensor

Plenty of ground clearance

Will update with more info and parts used, heading out to dial in the MTF. All of the piping was stock Vibrant you can buy online and only needed 2 pieces to be welded.

 

[07 Boss]

Looks nice! Did that intercooler come with the MAF bung on there or is that where you put it? I'm just wondering how smooth the air flow is right there. I'm assuming you moved it farther away from the TB because of that same reason. What was your issue with it being too close to the TB? Just curious as I think I may be doing some kind of custom induction plumbing and want to hear about why you did things a certain way.

 

[Wild White Pony]

Looks nice! Did that intercooler come with the MAF bung on there or is that where you put it? I'm just wondering how smooth the air flow is right there. I'm assuming you moved it farther away from the TB because of that same reason. What was your issue with it being too close to the TB? Just curious as I think I may be doing some kind of custom induction plumbing and want to hear about why you did things a certain way.

The maf flange was built into the outlet pipe and cam with the support brackets which eliminated the original radiator support. The air is clean and easier to tune for drivability, the room it freed up is amazing, you could never of put 3.5" piping using the original rad support. Tight and a pain with the original vortech 3" pipes always to close to the tensioner and had to many tight bends, was tired of breaking the skin off the knuckles. Also I wanted to move the meth injection after the sensor, the bigger 3,5" core is another benefit.

 

[travelers]

Looking good, l can see a lot of time and work went into this new setup.

 

[JeremyH]

Intercooler outlet is very clean signal since the intercooler is an air straightener. Stock like drivability.

 

[Department Of Boost]

I'm very very curious about what the cruising around town IAT's are vs ambient with it located there.

 

[Wild White Pony]

I'm very very curious about what the cruising around town IAT's are vs ambient with it located there.

Here is a snapshot with min n max values of my drive down to the gas station to log for adjusting the MTF right after completing the install. It was pretty hot and muggy low 90s, had to use a broom stick to keep the hood up cause the cheap ass struts wouldn't hold.
Idle at a stop it averaged 118, driving it dropped to a low of 110 at around 45mph. Have not put it on the highway yet still working on the STFT.

 

[Department Of Boost]

Here is a snapshot with min n max values of my drive down to the gas station to log for adjusting the MTF right after completing the install. It was pretty hot and muggy low 90s, had to use a broom stick to keep the hood up cause the cheap ass struts wouldn't hold.
Idle at a stop it averaged 118, driving it dropped to a low of 110 at around 45mph. Have not put it on the highway yet still working on the STFT.

Very interesting. I was theorizing about this a few weeks ago. That when the IAT is in the MAF (on a centri car) you're not seeing the real IAT because of latent heat in the intake.

Do you still get data from the MAF? Can you check MAF vs intake IAT at WOT?

 

[Wild White Pony]

Very interesting. I was theorizing about this a few weeks ago. That when the IAT is in the MAF (on a centri car) you're not seeing the real IAT because of latent heat in the intake.

Do you still get data from the MAF? Can you check MAF vs intake IAT at WOT?

Would have to do 2 pulls can't get data at the same time. All I would have to do is put a quick connect on the IAT sensor wires and switch. This comparison would be quite different than moving it between the 2 locations during normal driving as WOT is going to have a whole lot of meth being read with the IAT in the Intake Manifold location. I won't do any WOT tuning for a couple weeks when I can get an Appointment with my tuner on the dyno.

With the intake pipe between the Rad and the engine I thought I would see a considerable change between idle and speed. While installing I looked for an alternative route which I think a wire tuck and moving the PS res I can come straight up and over to the throttle body picking up a little less heat from the rad and fan. Maybe do this winter.

 

[Wild White Pony]

Another reason I did this was to compare the costs and benefits doing this or buying the Vortech inter cooler kit upgrade. The inter cooler upgrade from Vortech is around $1800.00, this upgrade is half the cost and gives more room, bigger size piping, blow through reading supporting more hp, larger inter cooler with maf flange built in, stable air for maf and of course the ability to move the IAT sensor to read meth injection.

Vortech HO kit: $1874.00 List

I've pretty much done the upgrade process from a non-inter cooled to current. A little history to this.

First V3 install a non-inter cooled V3 making 400rwhp

With HO upgrade and some meth injection

The 2 plastic Bosch BV just couldn't move enough air when I added a smaller pulley and a power pipe. I put a mini race BV on and still kept getting surging so
I added one of the Bosch BV back on, Drove and was a lot better but didn't work to my liking. I noticed the PW on my meth gauge had started to settle down, I knew I needed to circulate a bit more air. The plumping fittings that they give you for the power pipe were just to small I.D. and causing restriction.

Found the solution at Ace Hardware>..a great place.. Sink pipe in the plumbing section, cost $6.00. Makes a nice smooth seal on the inside of that
rubber 90deg and has a whole lot of inside diameter. Problem solved car ran great and PW stayed steady when letting off the gas.

With bigger return hose and sink pipe, dumped the second plastic BV and just used the Mini Race BV.

Now moved to the blow through setup, pushed the V3 to as much as it could give 18psi, tuning was difficult as the air wasn't very clean and I couldn't read the meth as it was injecting at the opening of the TB.

In my opinion if your going to upgrade your Vortech or Paxton or buy a HO tuner kit I would skip everything I have done in the past and go straight to making something like this new setup, it's just better and cheaper.

Will update the tuning of the maf in a bit, working out very well so far but everything I thought was going to happen, turned out opposite on the value inputs.

Till then a few more pics of the inter cooler.

 

[Department Of Boost]

No worries on the two IAT locations. It was just something I was curious about.

Are you going to sample and WOT IAT's without meth? I would be curious what they are.

Nice setup.

 

[Wild White Pony]

No worries on the two IAT locations. It was just something I was curious about.

Are you going to sample and WOT IAT's without meth? I would be curious what they are.


Nice setup.

Thanks,

I'll see if that can be done but on pump gas I doubt it would be safe.

Looking good, l can see a lot of time and work went into this new setup.

Thank you, it's been fun I enjoy this hobby.

 

[Wild White Pony]

Now for the tuning of the new setup:

First I just want to say I'm not a tuner, I do basic stuff like dialing in at the track adding mods and some tweaking drivability and then I pass it off to my tuner for final adjustment. Just a novice so I'm going to tell you what I did and what results happened but I really can't explain why some things came out the way they did.

Since I had the new inter cooler in my garage but didn't have the new blower or had fabricated the 3.5" tubing, I figured why not see if this new inter cooler and mount matched up to the old 3" piping. It did, all I had to do was put on some 90deg reducers and it coupled up. The intake side of the cooler to the blower was perfect, the output side fit but did angle out a little. Now I drive the car for a couple weeks and very happy with the maf counts being steady so started working on the 3.5" tubing to go with the setup. Blowers still not in so I hook the new inter cooler and 3.5" piping up to the old V3 Blower leaving the same values in the inter cooler as before.

I'm using a Pro-M maf which I hear is the same as a BA5000, ok well I put that Pro-M in the new inter cooler and took a stock maf I had and placed it in the original
location to close that up. I then pulled out the Pro-M transfer function sheet out and looked at the difference between the 3" Pipe size values and 3.5" values. Well it looked like about 30% more, so I took my current values in the tune and added 30% thinking this would put me in the ball game.

Ok here is where it goes wrong, the car starts and cough's up a big load of fuel snot, just pig rich and dies. WTF! happened this plan didn't work out, lowered it to 15% more, started up ran a little better but pig rich. WTF again, ok now I put the original values back when the maf was in the 3" pipe right before the TB and the dam thing fires up and runs pretty good so I took a ride and it seemed like nothing changes. Drove for a couple weeks while waiting for Blower and tubing to arrive, very happy with the steady maf counts.

Blower wasn't in yet but I had the new 3.5" tubing so I fabricated that up and decided just to hook that up to my old V3. Well the maf had been already housed in the 3.5" exit tube of the inter cooler and working well on the old MTF. With the new tubing installed nothing else changed I start the car up and start data logging drive up the street and MFr shut right down when I hit 4th gear, straight into limp mode. Again WTF I just changed the tubing, the maf was still in the same location sitting in the new 3.5" inter cooler.

So shut down the car started up and drove back down the street to my house. Pulled the datalog and ran the codes, Again now running rich and the following codes.
P0600 Serial Communication Link
P061B - Internal Control Module Torque Calculation Performance Description: Indicates a calculation error occurred in the powertrain control module (PCM).
P2105 Throttle Actuator Control System - Forced Engine Shutdown

Ok so I check all my wiring and stuff cause these codes relate to the TB, nothing wrong here. I look over the datalog and it's rich real rich on the Short Term Fuel Trims.
So when the maf is located in the 3.5" exit pipe of the inter cooler it had no effect on the values, but when you completed the setup with 3.5" tubing it had a tremendous effect, but I was expecting it to be lean not rich. Again here is where I can't answer cause again not a tuner.

Ok so now I'm code scurred cause I hate this shut down crap limp mode can't even really datalog. I'm looking over the log and found something interesting. It shut down down amost all the time in 4th gear when short term fuel trim hit 1.4 and would flat line, I guess this is the most it could read and if it last more than a moment and creates a flat the computer throws those codes thinking the TB isn't working correctly.

Yeah I know it's rich this is just the first drive down the street so.

Here it is the datalog that I can tell you right now throws the awful codes, so when you think you have a bad TB it may be your MTF.

So now I've removed 35% from the MTF and subtracted here 5% added 5% over there, have not finished yet but have been driving it around and it's running great. And none of these crazy codes or limp modes once those STFT are in line. Going to do some more tweaking tomorrow but everything is coming together very nice.

So why so opposite, I don't know but maybe some of the more knowledgeable guys on tuning could explain it.

 

[Scott]

Looking great Kurt! Any issues with the new IAT sensor location?

 

[blownGTvert]

Great job, the larger tubing will help a lot. How much boost? What are your power goals with this setup?

 

[Wild White Pony]

Looking great Kurt! Any issues with the new IAT sensor location?

Thanks Scott, no that's working out well, I'm learning a ton on the tuning part, the air is cleaner than where I had it before.

Great job, the larger tubing will help a lot. How much boost? What are your power goals with this setup?

I don't have a power goal, I would like to get this car to 9.9 something. I think it should be in the 700rwhp range, but I let my tuner decide what's best for max hp during the dyno.

 

[Unreal]

I've seen so many mixed things on the billet Ysi. I haven't seen a single one get close to the power levels I'm making on a cast Ysi so I skipped the upgrade. Hopefully yours works well but I have two friends that went back to the standard ones because they said they lost low end and barely gained anything up top with the billet wheel.

Then again at 700rwhp that is barely pushing it so it will rock.

 

[loots06]

Nice 3v!!

 

[Wild White Pony]

Nice 3v!!

Thank you..

I've seen so many mixed things on the billet Ysi. I haven't seen a single one get close to the power levels I'm making on a cast Ysi so I skipped the upgrade. Hopefully yours works well but I have two friends that went back to the standard ones because they said they lost low end and barely gained anything up top with the billet wheel.

Then again at 700rwhp that is barely pushing it so it will rock.

I have heard the same about the low end. I look at this as a growth type buy thats going to be durable compared to the V3 I had in. Down the road I picture a larger displacement swap for this car. I've heard the YSI likes bigger cubes and or rpm to get the most out of it. I spin the motor pretty hard hitting the low 7k's on the track. With a 4100 stall and overdrive I should get decent results, if not I'll put a cast wheel on and see how that goes.
The plan was to get a JT-B but after waiting for ever, since that seems to be the blower they use for new Mustang and now shortage I just went bigger and liked the 5K more on the max impeller speed. A while back Anderson Ford did a comparison between all these Vortech blowers, this dated and it showed the JT being a rather better fit overall for the 4.6.
https://www.andersonfordmotorsport.com/content/Centrifugal_Horse-12.09-5.0.pdf

 

[Wild White Pony]

Here's something that might help if you do your own piping.

I used Vibrant tubing purchased from Amazon, these pipes run around $30-$34.00 each.
Drivers Side, Blower to Intercooler:
2 90deg 3.5" tube
1 Straight
Welded the straight to one of the 90deg
Mounted BV on other 90deg

Passenger side, Intercooler to Intake.
1 90deg Welded about 4"s of straight to this 90
1 60deg
1 Straight

Make one of these, I didn't come up with it I saw it on the internet. I made this at work from a 3.5" Muffler Clamp, Large Washer and Vise Grips.

Make your own lips on the pipe is easy this way, start out with a mild indent which gives you a line to follow, then increase the indent by turning down vise grips till you have the shape to your liking.