Twin Twins

[Bobby]

Our fab guy does this for Pinsky and knows what he is doing. He just can get the exact bend every kit and uses prebent piping and make it all on the jig. Jeremy actually throught the sMe thing when he was installing his kit and once he got the turbo and down pipe together everything fell right in place. My kit on my car was made off this jig. The way he does it is he make the kit on the car then make a jig them builds a kit off of it and then pits that kit on the car. He still has the original kit up there at his shop. Same on our single kit. Jeremys kit is actually the 3rd kit made on this jig. I still dont have a dought that it all will fit right up after they get the vbands on (my fault. I thought they were in the box).

 

[Bobby]

This is hard to explain on here and be clear about it but i spoke with leo and talked to him. The only thing we werent sure about not fitting was on mikes auto and the fake catshitting something. They were not made in the jig because we dont have one for them.

 

[TexasBlownV8]

I did some further test-fitting and trying to align pipes on my driver side. No doubt, both inlet and outgoing pipes will need modifying to work with this massive transmission.
As such, I see where I need a change in the pipe going down from the manifold, so I'm going to cut and mock that up to fit, tack welded as needed. This change will give me the ability to better adjust the position of the turbine housing, which as it is now, can not be put into a proper position while maintaining good seal at the manifold. And with the trans pan that I am using, which is a deep aftermarket pan, I need to move the turbine housing forward just a little, and this change will allow that to occur and make it a proper fit.
As far as the downpipe going out, there is a position where I can get the turbine and pipe to fit up, but, it is way up near the pan and would interfere with shifter operation. On a manual trans, there would be plenty of room. But once a better angle is in place for the turbine, it'll be possible to correct that connection as well, although with a different angle.
At this point, I think this is the best approach to getting things worked out.

I'll be figuring out the passenger side today as well. It needs a little clearancing in a couple of areas on the trans housing first (a boss needs to be cut off), though.

 

[JeremyH]

Look foward seeing whats involved to fit the 4r70. Let us know what we can do to help.

 

[go302]

How do you see the cold side being affected by these alterations?

 

[TexasBlownV8]

I dont see the cold side as being a problem; my trans cooler lines are flexible, and may need some different routing, but the cold side piping should be OK. With the stock trans cooler between the radiator and condenser, the massive intercooler fits fine.

One of my "requirements" is that I can remove the trans pan without having to remove the turbos. If the exist piping has to be disconnected (at least on the driver side), that is acceptable. [I just changed the trans fluid and filter, so service should not be needed for awhile; but, someday it will.]
To make matters potentially worse, I am using an aftermarket deep pan, with a thick base. A stock pan would be easier to work with, but would still encounter potential challenges when being removed.

Here's some pics I took of the driver side, trying to figure it out today. For easy handling and figuring this out, I removed the turbo and just worked with the turbine housing, manifold pipe, and w/g. An the turbine heat blanket is not on yet, so that will require some room. Most of these are with the manifold flange snugged-tight, so it would hold it in as close to real position as possible. Gaps in the pics are 3/16" or smaller, most smaller.


- this is how the pipes "want" to fit, as far as the manifold piping and turbine housing like it to go; the turbine up to or very very close to the trans pan. But also, if the turbine was moved forward a little, even 1/2", that would put it near/into the opening in front of the pan; the ear sticking out may have to go, and that would be ok.

- here is "as good as it gets" as far as clearance with the turbine and trans pan; this is with the pipes underneath it all up against the frame, so this position is not quite possible:

- here is the same, with the assembly moved slightly off of the frame. The angle of the pic is a little misleading, as the rounder part of the turbine is still over the pan in such a way that it would not be able to be removed:

- clearance of the pipes to the frame, with the turbine in the position shown above. The space is about 1/8":

- here's how much room there is between the w/g and bushing: I can fit my fingers between the clamp and bushing, so about 1" of clearance at least:

I don't have a pic of the manifold connection but it is sitting quite a bit at an angle just for these pics. An angle correction of 10-20* would make it easier to rotate around into a better position, but also, a length reduction of 3/8"-1/2" would help with turbine clearance, as you can see in the pics.

Bobby and Jeremy have been working with us (even on weekends) on this and we are figuring out what to do as we go along. Again, at least on my install, this transmission is much larger than a 3650 or 6060, and fitment will be close in many areas. But there is room for it all, it will go in the area as designed...eventually!

 

[go302]

I guess my thought was that if you start moving the turbos around it would affect how the cold side pipes come together.

 

[TexasBlownV8]

Makes sense. The interconnecting piping has couplers on the ends, so there is some wiggle room naturally. We'll see!!!

 

[go302]

I mean if you're making very minor adjustments, say within a half inch or so, I don't think it'll be a problem with the wiggle room of the couplers like you said. I'm confident you guys will get this thing together with great fitment.

 

[TexasBlownV8]

Now for the passenger side. There were 2 ears on the trans that needed removal (pics taken, to be posted later).
To get the most room possible near the bellhousing, I removed the trans cooler lines, getting them out of the way for now. This side fit much better at the exhaust manifold, with plenty of room for adjustment/rotation of the turbo. I got it into a position such that the front 3" area nearly clears the k-member, with just minor trimming there likely needed. The turbine housing want to ride kind of low out the back, but, that's where the piping wants to put it, based on reference of the manifold and body where the heat shield is. A quick mock-fit of the exhaust pipe was not possible, not even close (almost like the angle of the downpipe flange is reversed.
There may be one area of the pipe that will need "hammer-adjusting", at the pan, but the rest of it looks like it might go into place. We'll do Leo's car first, and get it together and see where things should go before tackling this side.

All is not rosy though. On the 4r70, there is an ear in the area of where the o2 sensor needs to be. I don't know yet for sure, and need to get a sensor on the pipe and in place to be certain, but that ear may interfere with the 02 sensor. It will be very close. So can I remove that ear? perhaps, but I'm not going to, not that one.

We'll get the v-clamps and connect things up and see how it goes.

 

[Bobby]

Also not sure if everyone knows it but we are using mikes car to test fit the auto so this is where the differences are.

 

[TexasBlownV8]

indeed. I want to make that clear, too, that this is NOT typical with other cars. And, we knew going into this that there could be some minor fitment issues, and that I'd work with S&H to get it right, so that others would not have any issues.

Its absolutely amazing: we'll fight with one side on my car, then go under Leo's car with the TR6060, and there's so much more room, such that things have room to move around and get into a proper position.

 

[JeremyH]

I guess my thought was that if you start moving the turbos around it would affect how the cold side pipes come together.

Makes sense. The interconnecting piping has couplers on the ends, so there is some wiggle room naturally. We'll see!!!

Good point. This is how I actually helped get the turbos into the right place I installed the cold side y pipe up over the k member to help get the turbos into the right spot and then did the final tweaks to the clocking of the compressor covers. I believe I wrote that in the install thread as well.

 

[TexasBlownV8]

Can we figure out what we are going to do about the pipe I'm having issues with? Bobby suggested I send it to y'all for tweaking. I'm ok with that, if the turnaround is quick.

Speaking of cold-side, we're not there yet, but when we are, there are quite a few pieces to put together. One thing I'd like to see is a diagram or sketch of where every piece (and coupler) is supposed to go. There's one or two small pipes, and I did not see in the pics where those go.

The closest pic of being able to tell is actually one from the thread about the kit; and this my actually be good enough, mostly:

 

[TexasBlownV8]

..a few pics of passenger side..fitment will be verified once we get the exhaust clamps.

Here's a couple of ears that needed trimming off:

..and, removed:

Here's the o2 sensor bung and the part of the trans that may interfere with an o2sensor:

and, the w/g pipe that may need to be "compressed in" to give a little dent, so that it fits around the pan better:

 

[Bobby]

If it needs dinged use a ball ping hammer or a hammer and an extention. Also nake sure to let me know where to do this for other auto guys

 

[JeremyH]

 

[JEWC_Motorsports]

Mike are you concerned about heat transferring from the turbos to the transmission? Doesnt look like much room.

 

[TexasBlownV8]

Not concerned about heat; the pipe may hit the edge of the pan, so that is where it might need dinging. As long as there is some gap, that's fine.
Wont know for sure until we try to put it all in place.

 

[JeremyH]

Not concerned about heat; the pipe may hit the edge of the pan, so that is where it might need dinging. As long as there is some gap, that's fine.
Wont know for sure until we try to put it all in place.

It all fits tight when done with zero movement. My clearances are not too far off from what your looking at with the 4r70. Your trans pan looks a bit larger though, looks bigger than the 4r70 Greg had that we took preliminary measurements off of.