Coyote vs 3v exhaust sound.

[ghunt81]

I remember reading somewhere once, that the 351/302 HO firing order made better power at some part of the RPM range and that's why they used it on the 302 HO. I dunno. I know the LS1 uses that firing order, probably current LS engine still do.

 

[deebo05]

Wasn't talking to you like you're "a fucking bitch" but if you self identify as that.... that's your business. This board is pretty strong on having excellent and accurate tech info. That is what I was saying. If you make a statement as fact, be able to back it up. Expect to be challenged from time to time.

If you are wrong. Admit it and learn and move on. If your balls get busted for it. Own it. If you have thin skin, move along. This is not the board you're looking for.

Now after your post I decided to dig a little deeper. Because I like to learn and being challenged is a good thing. Found conflicting reports and claims. So I went to the horses mouth if you will.

In the 2015 F150 Owners Manual it says the 5.0 is still the same as the Mustang 5.0. But in the 2016 and 2017 and 2018 F150 Owners Manuals it says the 5.0 is now 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8. Same as the 302 HO/351W/351C/351M/400M/4.6 2V/4.6 3V/4.6 4V.

Your 2015 file contradicts the Owners Manual. Maybe the change was midyear or maybe the manual wasn't updated.

But this is "news". I'd bet many here were not aware of this change. I wasn't. Coyote trucks have been around for about 8 years now and they are not all the same firing order as the Mustang 5.0. Had you said Ford changed the truck firing order in 2015 or 2016 to the old modular order, that would have been met with a different response.

Lighten up. Grow a thicker skin. Don't be "a fucking bitch" about things.

Neither of us was totally right or totally wrong.

zero butt hurt here

yes i should have said later model f150 has the 4.6 firing order.....i did back up my statement.

now the reason i went on the defensive is because you decided to give advice on researching that you obviously did not follow, you just did quick half ass google search to try to prove me wrong and then came at me sideways with dont post shit bla bla bla bla it not cool.

follow your own advice next time and dont give any advice about research and forum lessons.

now i wont go to deep on the fact that you called me a bitch in your last post cause there is always that one keyboard warrior that runs their cock holster until they get in public, then they curl up in the fetal position with their thumb in the mouth.

next you want to make a comment towards me , come at me correct.

 

[tjm73]

zero butt hurt here

yes i should have said later model f150 has the 4.6 firing order.....i did back up my statement.

now the reason i went on the defensive is because you decided to give advice on researching that you obviously did not follow, you just did quick half ass google search to try to prove me wrong and then came at me sideways with dont post shit bla bla bla bla it not cool.

follow your own advice next time and dont give any advice about research and forum lessons.

now i wont go to deep on the fact that you called me a bitch in your last post cause there is always that one keyboard warrior that runs their cock holster until they get in public, then they curl up in the fetal position with their thumb in the mouth.

next you want to make a comment towards me , come at me correct.

Please quote where I called you a bitch. I didn't. I didn't "come at you" I challenged your statement. You are still showing you have a thin skin.

 

[eighty6gt]

i got mind control over deebo

he says, SHUT THE FUCK UP

I be quiet!


but he leave...


I be talkin' again!

 

[Wes06]

"Man fu©k deebo!"

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

Coyote firing order: 15486372
4.6 firing order: 13726548

Seems the Coyote setup will send more even exhaust pulses and could be better for heat management of the cylinders, as you don't have two cylinders on the same bank firing in sequence like on the 4.6.

That's not the case actually. If you break down the firing order on each bank, it's still odd firing on both engines so you'd still have a burble at idle with a guttural note at higher rpm. The Coyote has adjacent cylinders 2 & 1 firing in succession, while the 4.6 has adjacent cylinders 6 & 5 firing in succession.

5.0 Coyote:

Right bank 1-4-3-2: 180* between 1 & 4, 270* between 4 & 3, 180* between 3 & 2, 90* between 2 & 1.
Left bank 5-8-6-7: 180* between 5 & 8, 90* between 8 & 6, 180* between 6 & 7, 270* between 7 & 5.

4.6 Modular:

Right bank 1-3-2-4: 90* between 1 & 3, 180* between 3 & 2, 270* between 2 & 4, 180* between 4 & 1.
Left bank 7-6-5-8: 180* between 7 & 6, 90* between 6 & 5, 180* between 5 & 8, 270* between 8 & 7.

The difference in exhaust note is due to the changed firing order, header design, type of crossover (H or X), and the tuned sound produced by the mufflers.

Altering the firing order requires a change in header design to optimize exhaust flow.

5.0 Coyote:

Right header: Paired 1 & 3, 2 & 4 primaries.
Left header: Paired 5 & 6, 7 & 8 primaries.

4.6 Modular:

Right header: Paired 1 & 2, 3 & 4 primaries.
Left header: Paired 5 & 7, 6 & 8 primaries.

The stock header design is a compromise due to space constraints, and even aftermarket long tube headers are mostly a 4-into-1 design rather than Tri-Y. BBK makes "tuned length" shorty headers, but the primaries on those are only paired correctly on one bank and not on the other so they're not as good as they could have been.

 

[Norm Peterson]

View attachment 66013

adjacent cylinders firing, then... (across banks)

There's nothing in common with the sound!

The basic burble/rumble is inherently present in both, which is certainly "something in common". Though a cat-back with very good flow sharing (i.e. X-pipe) will mostly eliminate that, and I suspect the Coyote's VCT and exhaust manifolding differences make for other differences in sound 'character'.


Norm

 

[eighty6gt]

The coyote sounds equally terrible in a cobra kit car (no crossover whatsoever,) as it does in an s197.. You may be onto something with the VCT.

I'll just keep hand making parts for my cruddy old 4.6.

 

[Sky Render]

Why the heck would Ford change the firing order for one platform but not the other when they're both using essentially the same engine?!

 

[eighty6gt]

Emissions is a thought. So many F150's. I bet the power profile is identical.

It's a mystery!

 

[tjm73]

Can't imagine emissions would be changed at all. Same 8 cylinders are firing just in a different order. Same 8 cylinders producing the same 8 pulses of spent gases.

My guess is the "HO" firing order favors low end power production. Trucks need that. The Coyote firing order probably favors higher end power production.

When the truck FO changed, power went up 15 hp and torque went up slightly while the peak torque moved down the in rpm by 400. Probably shifted all the low end torque numbers higher over the ''11-'14 numbers. At least that's my guess.

 

[eighty6gt]

After a lot of digging around, If I get a truck DOHC I'll probably just swap the mustang cams onto it. Only way.

 

[Juice]

I remember reading somewhere once, that the 351/302 HO firing order made better power at some part of the RPM range and that's why they used it on the 302 HO. I dunno. I know the LS1 uses that firing order, probably current LS engine still do.

The Non - HO firing order had #7 & #8 fire in sequence. This configuration caused some inductive crossfiring issues on those cylinders (remember spark plug wires? ). This is why Ford switched to the "HO" firing order.

 

[eighty6gt]

ah, so when ford went back to the distributor in 2015 on the F150's they also returned to the HO order... Mustangs kept coil on plug

 

[Norm Peterson]

http://www.enginelabs.com/engine-tech/cam-valvetrain/firing-order-swaps-whats-best-for-your-engine/


Norm

 

[RED09GT]

Maybe it is the single exhaust valve of the 3v vs the duals in the yote?

Would also explain why the 4v 4.6's don't sound as sharp as the 3v/2v cars.

 

[Sky Render]

ah, so when ford went back to the distributor in 2015 on the F150's they also returned to the HO order... Mustangs kept coil on plug

Wait, what? The F-150 has a distributor again? What is this, 1993?

 

[tjm73]

Wait, what? The F-150 has a distributor again? What is this, 1993?

You got a problem with 1993?

 

[ghunt81]

You callin' 1993 a fuckin bitch?

 

[tjm73]

You better come at 1993 correct.