MindIfISmoke's? Built Part 3.

[MindIfISmoke?]

Your on the stock crank sprocket this time? Lockout?

 

[TurboX]

Wow, lots of good info in here now. I never thought the timing system would be my biggest worry of my build, but with Buzz's tensioners and this, I am starting to wonder.

Haven't posted because I'm out of town working but I've been told my failure was definatly caused by hitting the rev limiter. I suspect my damage was done on my last motor and the power of this motor just exposed the already weakened parts. The only question I have is, did leaving all that tension in the chains when degreeing the cams help or hurt my situation.

When I rebuild, I will barely apply pressure to the tensioners on final assembly.

To others reading this thread, we all want a shitload of horse power but it is not easy, cheap or done over night. Look at the big builds like Chevykiller,Stroker or even the JPC cars. Im on my 2nd motor and 3rd build in 2 years, if it doesn't work this time I'm done. Simply not worth the money I've sunk into this thing, I will go buy a new GT500 and call it a day. I don't wanna settle for 800rwhp but damn my car is 2 years old, has 12,000 miles and been on jackstands for most the time I've owned it.

 

[05stroker]

Your on the stock crank sprocket this time? Lockout?

Yes, I have the staock gear with lockouts now. I have that spacer if you end up staying with the adjustable unit. I have been doing some reading on them since I took them out and find several post about needing to pin them. With that said this is the first broken one I have seen. If you need it I will send it, if not I will keep it with the gears for a later date.

Haven't posted because I'm out of town working but I've been told my failure was definatly caused by hitting the rev limiter. I suspect my damage was done on my last motor and the power of this motor just exposed the already weakened parts. The only question I have is, did leaving all that tension in the chains when degreeing the cams help or hurt my situation.

When I rebuild, I will barely apply pressure to the tensioners on final assembly.

To others reading this thread, we all want a shitload of horse power but it is not easy, cheap or done over night. Look at the big builds like Chevykiller,Stroker or even the JPC cars. Im on my 2nd motor and 3rd build in 2 years, if it doesn't work this time I'm done. Simply not worth the money I've sunk into this thing, I will go buy a new GT500 and call it a day. I don't wanna settle for 800rwhp but damn my car is 2 years old, has 12,000 miles and been on jackstands for most the time I've owned it.

Yes, but I love spending my whole weekend in the garage chasing down problems instead of driving my car, spending time on the lake in my boat and drinking cold beer like everyone else...... NOT!!!

 

[MindIfISmoke?]

Haven't posted because I'm out of town working but I've been told my failure was definatly caused by hitting the rev limiter. I suspect my damage was done on my last motor and the power of this motor just exposed the already weakened parts. The only question I have is, did leaving all that tension in the chains when degreeing the cams help or hurt my situation.

When I rebuild, I will barely apply pressure to the tensioners on final assembly.

To others reading this thread, we all want a shitload of horse power but it is not easy, cheap or done over night. Look at the big builds like Chevykiller,Stroker or even the JPC cars. Im on my 2nd motor and 3rd build in 2 years, if it doesn't work this time I'm done. Simply not worth the money I've sunk into this thing, I will go buy a new GT500 and call it a day. I don't wanna settle for 800rwhp but damn my car is 2 years old, has 12,000 miles and been on jackstands for most the time I've owned it.

I agree! Shit isn't cheap and definitely doesn't happen overnight. I've learned this the hard way.

Yes, I have the staock gear with lockouts now. I have that spacer if you end up staying with the adjustable unit. I have been doing some reading on them since I took them out and find several post about needing to pin them. With that said this is the first broken one I have seen. If you need it I will send it, if not I will keep it with the gears for a later date.

I think I'm going to instal them strait up this time.

 

[05stroker]

I think I'm going to instal them strait up this time.

Just look at it like I did, you can always do it later after you are done tuning and want that extra 20 hp you cant get from the 30 psi we can throw at these things.

For me the N2O setup is easier at this point. LOL

 

[JoshK]

I have a question for you guys with all this cam talk. I am a little bit overwhelmed with the thought of degreeing cams with lockouts and an adjustable gear. WOuld a person if essentially the same setup be better off to go with a set of custom cams with a little retard built into them and lockouts, or keep the stock cams and go with limiters? Would the BBR stage 2 cams be able to be run straight up with lockouts or would you have to degree some retard with them(as I have seen some turbo guys using them)?

Just look at it like I did, you can always do it later after you are done tuning and want that extra 20 hp you cant get from the 30 psi we can throw at these things.

For me the N2O setup is easier at this point. LOL

So installing lockouts strait up will only cost about 20 hp from degreeing them 4 degrees retard?

 

[MindIfISmoke?]

Pretty much

 

[lito]

Did yours have the spacer?

Yes, if not it will not ever line up properly as the stock one and would generate some torsion that would explain what happened to Matt here.

The only question I have is, did leaving all that tension in the chains when degreeing the cams help or hurt my situation.

That is my guess as we discussed by email, if the tension is too much and given that the tensioner ratchet locks it would leave no slack on the chain that could absorb part of the accel forces on the system and somethin had to give.

 

[05stroker]

So installing lockouts strait up will only cost about 20 hp from degreeing them 4 degrees retard?

What I was saying is, we will only see about a 20 hp or so gain from the degreeing of the cams vrs just installing them straight up on the timing marks. We can make that up with boost or N2O easy with built motors. It is a lot of work to degree the cams after the engine is installed.

Not sure about the 4 deg retard on the turbo cars though. Just trying to stress at this point it would still be a minimal gain to fight it further. It can be done later if needed.

I'm sure at this point he is just like me, we just want to drive them instead of working on them!

 

[MindIfISmoke?]

I'm reinstalling everything right now strait up.

 

[fiveohwblow]

Good deal Matt.

 

[BruceH]

I have a question for you guys with all this cam talk. I am a little bit overwhelmed with the thought of degreeing cams with lockouts and an adjustable gear. WOuld a person if essentially the same setup be better off to go with a set of custom cams with a little retard built into them and lockouts, or keep the stock cams and go with limiters? Would the BBR stage 2 cams be able to be run straight up with lockouts or would you have to degree some retard with them(as I have seen some turbo guys using them)?

Remember that the stock cams have 7 degrees of advance built into them. Locking them isn't going to help the top end. Setting the cams one tooth off would get you 8.6 degrees of retard which is fairly close to the factory tune retard of 11 degrees at wot.

Any reason why not 20 degree limiters? I've run both the livernois and comp limiters without issue.

You also might think about calling comp cams about your build. They have a hotline just for lining people up with the correct cam or custom grind.

 

[Mike K]

Glad you figured it out Matt.

 

[JoshK]

I'm really confused with all of this right now Bruce, some people are say to not run limiters at power levels like this and I just don't know. I would like to run an aftermarket cam and like the BBR 2 cams. Just not sure which way to go. Right now I am thinking of going with the BBR 2 cams with lockouts installed straight up, but will definetly be following this build. Right now it is either the stock cams with limiters or the bbr 2s with lockouts...

 

[BruceH]

I'm really confused with all of this right now Bruce, some people are say to not run limiters at power levels like this and I just don't know. I would like to run an aftermarket cam and like the BBR 2 cams. Just not sure which way to go. Right now I am thinking of going with the BBR 2 cams with lockouts installed straight up, but will definetly be following this build. Right now it is either the stock cams with limiters or the bbr 2s with lockouts...

Is that because of the stiff springs needed with high boost levels? The highest I ever ran was 17psi and it was with 127300 cams which are below .5" lift. Theoretically anything below .5 can't have ptv contact. Never used limiters and had 26113 springs.

How big has your build become? Lol.

 

[Mike K]

I'm just soaking in info for future reference. S&h turbo should be installed this winter.

 

[JoshK]

Is that because of the stiff springs needed with high boost levels? The highest I ever ran was 17psi and it was with 127300 cams which are below .5" lift. Theoretically anything below .5 can't have ptv contact. Never used limiters and had 26113 springs.

How big has your build become? Lol.

Thread jack

I have a 298 eagle stroker kit coming and have a billet 67 turbo. I am think about going return style on E85. I just dont know what the hell I am doing when it comes to cams and timing. . .

 

[keoni1984]

Glad you figured it out. Now.....VIDS!!!

 

[danbogart]

You gonna swap in your timing components while you're at it? Might be good insurance.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

 

[JeremyH]

Glad you found it Matt!