Valve spring availability

[BeachMonkey100]

I want the trick flow valve springs #: tfs-16213-24 for my build. Only place I can find that has them is summit racing, but wouldn't ship out if ordered today until 8/18. Does anyone else know where these are available?

 

[W3bb3r04]

Whats wrong with these?
http://www.briantooleyracing.com/trick-flow-tfs-15410-24-4-6-3-valve-spring-set-of-24.html

 

[BeachMonkey100]

Will they work with factory retainers and keepers?

 

[W3bb3r04]

Im currently running those in my motor. I haven't ran it long or anything but I used factory retainers and keepers with no clearance issues.

 

[BeachMonkey100]

Okay, are you running stock cams?
Because I will be running stock cams and still using VCT and stuff.

 

[W3bb3r04]

Okay, are you running stock cams?
Because I will be running stock cams and still using VCT and stuff.

Im running custom grind turbo cams and locked out VCT

 

[BeachMonkey100]

Alright, and you haven't had a problem with the factory keepers? I am almost wondering if it makes any difference to a certain point whether it's important to change to hardened keepers or not.

 

[W3bb3r04]

I haven't heard anything really. As long as you are keeping the same valves/valve design and retainers then I don't see why youd need them.

 

[BeachMonkey100]

makes sense, unless I find out anything otherwise I guess I will be ordering these on Monday. Just didn't want to overkill the motor with spring pressure since it won't be boosted for a little while longer yet while I gather the rest of my parts.

 

[swflastang05]

PAC springs also use the OEM locks and retainers. I'm running the PAC 1533 springs on my new motor and reusing the stock locks and retainers with custom cams locked out .550 / .560 lift. These springs would most certainly work with stock cams too.

 

[BruceH]

I'm running factory keepers with no problems. Why do you think they would be a problem? Are they an issue with other engines?

Alright, and you haven't had a problem with the factory keepers? I am almost wondering if it makes any difference to a certain point whether it's important to change to hardened keepers or not.

 

[05stroker]

I use factory also with 550/560 lift cams and high load comp valve springs spinning to 7500 rpms.

 

[BeachMonkey100]

I forgot about PAC springs completely. And Bruce on the older push rod motors there use to be problems with certain keepers at higher RPMs with boost so I was wondering if these would be sufficient.

Only thing I need to know now is if I still need to lock out the phasers. All I am doing is installing a stiffer spring for boost, stock cams being used.

 

[JeremyH]

The factory 3v retainers are steel and are pretty decent, they will start to flex when getting to the max lift of your springs and running high rpm. They will fatigue sooner over time and start increasing your chances of valve float compared to hardened steel or titanium. Can you measure the difference or put a time frame on it I don't know.

Watch some valve train videos on youtube you will be shocked at how much movement/flex there is in the upper rpms with higher lift cams and stiffer springs.

If I was running stock cams or mild cams I would have no issues running factory retainers. Not that you have to, but if you plan for lots of lift and rpm some stronger retainers may be a good investment.

And no you do not need to lock out the cams phasers just for stiffer springs. You will be leaving around 100rwhp on the table locking out stock cams with a boosted built motor anyway. If you ever need to lock cams because of their high lift get a cam spec'd for being locked out.

 

[BeachMonkey100]

The factory 3v retainers are steel and are pretty decent, they will start to flex when getting to the max lift of your springs and running high rpm. They will fatigue sooner over time and start increasing your chances of valve float compared to hardened steel or titanium. Can you measure the difference or put a time frame on it I don't know.

Watch some valve train videos on youtube you will be shocked at how much movement/flex there is in the upper rpms with higher lift cams and stiffer springs.

If I was running stock cams or mild cams I would have no issues running factory retainers. Not that you have to, but if you plan for lots of lift and rpm some stronger retainers may be a good investment.

And no you do not need to lock out the cams phasers just for stiffer springs. You will be leaving around 100rwhp on the table locking out stock cams with a boosted built motor anyway. If you ever need to lock cams because of their high lift get a cam spec'd for being locked out.

That's what I was referring too, I know in the upper RPMs it starts to flex. When I was building the smaller kart engines we would have the same thing happen and the dampening of the springs weakened and started to float the valves. I'll have to find that video somewhere and post it from someone that took it.

And it's still on the table to get aftermarket retainers or not. It might be a good investment just to have it and piece of mind I suppose.

Okay, I ask because I have seen where some have said stiffer springs don't work with stock came and vct and stuff like that. That made me think you had to lock the cams out for the stiffer spring. But really only time I would need to lock it out is for cams requiring lock outs in their spec.

 

[BruceH]

I forgot about PAC springs completely. And Bruce on the older push rod motors there use to be problems with certain keepers at higher RPMs with boost so I was wondering if these would be sufficient.

Only thing I need to know now is if I still need to lock out the phasers. All I am doing is installing a stiffer spring for boost, stock cams being used.

That's what I was thinking. All too often mod motors are built on the failure of other motors. Well intentioned builders don't stop to think that maybe the motor has a different design and different, higher quality components.

Anyone I've known who ran stiff springs without lockouts always ended up going with lockouts. The phasers can only overcome so much and when they hit the limit cam position will be all over the place.

Locking out the factory cams isn't a good idea though. IIRC the icl is 96 which is only going to be a benefit at lower rpms. If you have to lock them out then either lock them out advanced 10 degrees or it's time to change cams.

Good luck either way.

 

[BeachMonkey100]

That's what I'm thinking as well, I'm not trying to lock or limit anything just want a spring to hold up to turbo while I still retain my stock cams. just don't want a spring pressure so excessive that it kills the phasers ability to do it's job.

 

[JeremyH]

I'm using my vct with comp 26113-24 springs and stainless steel retainers zero issues. They have an advertised .550 lift and I run a .550 lift cam with them. I also run comp 20 degree limiters.

 

[BeachMonkey100]

Just messaged you Jeremy.

 

[BruceH]

I've been running those same springs with a variety of cams. Absolutely no problems with vct functioning properly. They are about the only spring that people don't ever seem to have issues with.

The stiffer 26125 and TFS are the ones that start screwing with vct. It's funny because some people run them with phasers and never have an issue but others do have issues.

I'm using my vct with comp 26113-24 springs and stainless steel retainers zero issues. They have an advertised .550 lift and I run a .550 lift cam with them. I also run comp 20 degree limiters.