Strut Tower Brace....Fact or Fiction?

Rich

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I tried it man, but I saw 32 minutes and closed it. My attention span cannot last that long on one subject, hahahaha
 

Gabe

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I've driven and autocrossed my '13 GT with and without a strut tower brace, never noticed a difference.
Same thing with the wife's Shelby.
She hasn't had one on the car in about 3-4 years, since installing the TVS which made the stock bar not clear
 

Mubzeii

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I have a 2014 Ford Mustang v6 I recently purchased an axle-back pype bomb exhaust and a ford performance x pipe all from American muscle. when I replace it with the factory hardware will it trip an oxygen sensor code? if so what should I do to avoid tripping the code.
 

Greg Hazlett

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I have a 2014 Ford Mustang v6 I recently purchased an axle-back pype bomb exhaust and a ford performance x pipe all from American muscle. when I replace it with the factory hardware will it trip an oxygen sensor code? if so what should I do to avoid tripping the code.

What does this have to do with a STB....?
 

Juice

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I thought this video was interesting.................
Strut Tower Brace or Towel Bar? Engineering Explained - YouTube

Kinda makes a point.............

Enjoy!
Watched most of it, and he doesn't actually test the effects of the tower brace. Show me with and without the bar at 1G or better cornering force, and on a stock chassis s197 (the apple). He is using a Porche for the testing, that had all the seams welded, sitting static. Shaking the body by hand, or adding weight to the end of a bar. (the orange)

I have not driven mine on track since adding the strut brace. I "think" the car feels a bit more solid. lol
 

xeninworx

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I have a Drake Muscle front strut bar in my 14 V6. I immediately noticed a difference as soon as I turned the steering wheel. It felt easier to turn the wheel as the towers didn’t have any flex to them. I also have a Shelby rear strut bar. Noticed a difference when cornering. It felt more tighter and easier to break traction since the rear couldn’t flex. If you look at the convertibles, they have more bracing since they have no roofs. There’s nothing at the top tying both sides together. My wife’s 2016 Accord has a front tower brace stock which is odd because the strut towers are close to the firewall so it shouldn’t flex much but I guess Honda weren’t satisfied with the amount of flex.
 

Norm Peterson

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You're going to feel more difference - subjectively - with any of the usual STBs than you'll actually gain in terms of chassis stiffness.

Chassis torsional stiffness is a problem in 3 dimensions, and the best that any 2-point STB can do is close in the chassis structure at a single longitudinal location. You do see this stiffening effect gradually diminish over perhaps a few inches either side of the STB location, but it's still correct to consider this stiffening effect to be localized.

In other words, you're stiffening only a single vertical-transverse plane along the car's entire wheelbase, and if you're effectively stiffening, say, 6" of length out of a Mustang's 107" wheelbase, you're not increasing the stiffness of the other 101" at all. Adding a diagonal brace in that same vertical-transverse plane does make that plane stiffer, but still won't do anything for the other 101".

Both the Garage Time guy and the Engineering Explained guy note that when you tie the two towers together that you get to use both towers' stiffnesses. Which is true as far as it goes, but does not tell the whole story (or even the most useful part of it). I think I'm going to have to draw some pictures before it'll make sense, but it has to do with the fact that the inside and outside tires are not loaded equally and do not produce equal cornering forces.

Garage Time guy's measured results weren't the least bit surprising. A different kind of 3-point brace would most likely have shown considerably more improvement.


Back to the subjective part . . . one thing that even light-duty stiffeners can do is change the structural vibration picture. They can chase more noticeable vibration modes out of the picture completely, where you're left with less noticeable modeshapes. You have to be visualizing the car structure vibrating like a massively complex tuning fork here, that when you tie off a point that's vibrating a lot relative to another point to that other point you change that vibration shape completely. A little like grabbing the tips of a simple tuning fork between your fingers, actually.

Vibrations are a part of what you perceive as "chassis solidity", which isn't the same thing as chassis stiffness (though there is a loose relationship between the two). That's why it 'feels' better, the car doesn't feel as "loosey-goosey" as it might have before. This concept can and should be extended to many of the other add-on stiffening that's available.


Sketches are going to take some time. Maybe I'll include a sketch suggesting the possible benefit of running a 2-point STB specifically for hard braking . . . and I have at least one thought related to stiffnesses in general.


I've been down this road before (a number of times, on various forums). As a structural analyst/engineer, this kind of stuff is very much in my wheelhouse. I'm retired these days, but I didn't suddenly forget everything I knew about the concepts.


Norm
 
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Juice

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Thanks Norm! I was hoping you would chime in.
 

Pentalab

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I installed the steeda chromoly strut tower brace on my 2010 auto. Unlike the FRPP brace I had on before (with just 2 x oval slots at each end), the steeda brace uses 4 x round holes at each end, so it's a tight fit. Steeda brace is rvs threaded at one end, so it's length can be adjusted. Also installed the steeda strut mounts, which allows for camber adjustment, (tweaked for max neg camber). You only have aprx 26 ft lbs allowed on those 8 x nuts.

I look at it as closing off the 4th side of a rectangle. I know a few folks who have gotten into accidents, and the body repair shops all said, without the front stb, the car would have been a right off. All 3 of em were hit on passenger side wheel well area. Below the eng, I also have the oem ford 'A arm brace'...
(which actually ties the back end of the K frame together), and the BMR A arm brace, ( which actually does tie the A arms together, and also the pair of steeda CM front strut corner braces. With all 5 x braces installed, yes, it feels more...'solidified'. Steeda eng mounts also installed, with their stiffer durometer option.
 

Norm Peterson

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I installed the steeda chromoly strut tower brace on my 2010 auto. Unlike the FRPP brace I had on before (with just 2 x oval slots at each end), the steeda brace uses 4 x round holes at each end, so it's a tight fit.
Four bolts do provide a somewhat more rigid connection by adding in some bending stiffness at the connections. Not a whole lot in the overall scheme of chassis stiffness, but better than none at all.


Norm
 

Pentalab

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Four bolts do provide a somewhat more rigid connection by adding in some bending stiffness at the connections. Not a whole lot in the overall scheme of chassis stiffness, but better than none at all.


Norm
4 bolts at each end.... 8 in total.
 

Norm Peterson

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Seems my layout, sketch, and lettering skills aren't what they once were. Sorry.


Notes on STBs web.jpg


If you care to try some rough numbers, let FY1 = 1700 lbs, FY2 = 300 lbs, STB1 = 570 lbs, STB2 = 100 lbs, displacement at tower 1 (unbraced) = 0.057" and displacement at tower 2 (unbraced) = 0.010" for a tower stiffness of 10,000 lb/in.

Those are just numbers for illustration but are at least in the ballpark for about 1g cornering.


Norm
 

Norm Peterson

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On chassis torsional stiffnesses in general - adding more definitely gets into the "realm of diminishing returns" as the original stiffness goes up.

A wet-noodle chassis like the 2003 Mustang convertible (at about 3500 ft*lbs/degree torsional stiffness) needs a lot of help if you're going to tune the handling via spring and sta-bar stiffnesses . . . otherwise you lose a lot of what you're trying to do when the load transfer you're trying to move from one end to the other evaporates as the chassis deflects torsionally. A little like pushing on a rope, actually.

The S197 is much stiffer at around 15,500 ft*lbs/degree, so there just isn't nearly as much to be gained mechanically . . . we're looking at less than a quarter of a degree of torsional deflection here (less, once you include tire flexibility). But the improvement in subjective feel is there, and the improvement in driver confidence coming from that.


Norm
 

kerrynzl

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I dont care how I go faster, as long as it is faster! lol

The correct term to describe the engineering advantages on street vehicle is "the placebo effect"

Unless you have spherical bearings in the upper platform, there is no gains.[lateral/side bending loads at the upper tower is almost non-existent]

To increase torsional stiffness [using only braces] you would need full length horizontal diagonal "X" braces going forward to the radiator support , AND another vertical diagonal "X" brace beside the radiator support. [similar to a Formula Ford space frame]

Ford didn't even bother on the FR500C, all they did was seam weld the unibody for torsional stiffness.
 

dark steed

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giphy.gif

This is about to become the new political sub-forum... lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Juice

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The correct term to describe the engineering advantages on street vehicle is "the placebo effect"

Unless you have spherical bearings in the upper platform, there is no gains.[lateral/side bending loads at the upper tower is almost non-existent]

To increase torsional stiffness [using only braces] you would need full length horizontal diagonal "X" braces going forward to the radiator support , AND another vertical diagonal "X" brace beside the radiator support. [similar to a Formula Ford space frame]

Ford didn't even bother on the FR500C, all they did was seam weld the unibody for torsional stiffness.
I keep laptimes to see how well mods/adjustments work. Stopwatch dont lie. ;)
 

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