2013 GT suspension plan - please help?

[martin_nj]

Hi All,

I'm very new to V8s and Mustangs but not so new to the track.

I've run Lime Rock, Summit, NJMP and Beaverun (now known as Pitt International)

I just bought a 2013 GT and need to fix the awful suspension it comes with from the factory. Well, it isn't awful around town, there it is wonderful, quiet and smooth.

Knowing full well that I will have to pay for performance in both money and NVH, what mods do you suggest to help on the track and which increase NVH the LEAST ?


I have a 2013, GT, 3.73 gears and a tech package. Base stereo, cloth seats, 18" all season 235 tires, base level brakes.



Thanks!
-Me

 

[Sky Render]

The stock suspension is far from awful.

What are your goals? What handling characteristics are you trying to change, improve, or modify? What is your budget?

My first suggestion is to get rid of the crappy all-season tires and depleted-uranium stock wheels.

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[martin_nj]

you're right it is far from horrible - it grips very well


i would like to improve its transitions. i haven't had it on track yet but on the street

1) the dive and squat makes it harder to give it quick inputs and have the car ready for your next command.. how to explain it - you ask it to brake it does so but then asks you to wait while the body finishes the braking/diving.

2) on the highway emergency lane change maneuvers really don't inspire confidence.


i do realize i will have to drive this car a bit differently and i don't want to turn this into a go-kart per se... but i do want to get the body roll under control (and hopefully not lower my overall grip traction)

for budget i would really like to keep it under $1500 not including wheels and tires and brakes. strictly suspension bits

 

[Conekiller]

I got all my suspension parts for a little under $1500, made a huge difference in the handling and responsiveness of the car. Car is much quicker to set and react to inputs without much change (imo) in quality of ride.

Koni sport struts/shocks
Steeda sport springs & HD camber plates
UMI adjustable panhard bar

All those can be purchase from Sam Strano as well (@ stranoparts.com) and he is very helpful with answering any questions you may have.

 

[kevinatfms]

if you are on a budget:
steeda sport springs
KONI STR's
camber bolts
UMI adjustable poly panhard bar

 

[SoundGuyDave]

Call Sam Strano...



The difference in a simple spring/damper/bar package is really quite stunning. Also, watch my helmet in the rear-veiw... the "harder" suspension is actually moving it around less than with stock-ish spring rates and softer dampers.

 

[martin_nj]

@soundguydave - can you describe how it feels around town, over bumps, rail road tracks, rough surfaces?

@kevin + @conekiller - you both seem to like the steeda springs so that's a good consensus there... i had koni yellows on my previous car they were decent

 

[iceguyb14]

I'd recommend getting the eiback pro system plus or the sport system plus. Comes with a lot and will be good at the track. Camber bolts (or plates if you want to spend a couple hundred $). Also an adj panhard bar to recenter the rear end after lowering the car. Also, some new LCAs would be good to and some relocation brackets.

 

[martin_nj]

so according to stranoparts.com the SRT and the ultralites are pretty amazing around town.. the desc reads that is a really well mannered.

i gotta meet some of you guys in real life and try out your rides =]

desc of suspensions are like youtube videos of exhaust they don't capture 100% of the story

 

[Morris]

I recently did the suspension on my 2012 brembo gt. First I did upper and lower control arms to remove the wheel hop as well as the relocation brackets. Don't move them into the lower holes or it will ruin the handling.

Then I did the Koni sports (sounds like you should opt for the sports too if you are tracking the car) with the steeda sport springs and MM camber plates. The springs and shocks transformed the car. They will take care of the issues you mentioned above and some......and then a little more.....night and day!

How does it ride (so far I have only used the soft setting have not even tried the firmer settings yet) so, set to soft........at first I thought it was the same, maybe only very slightly firmer than the stock brembo set up. Then after I hit a few dips and bumps on the freeway I realized that yes it is much firmer than the stock set up, but not for driving around the city, just when you take a hit to the suspension or when it's compressed very fast then your gonna know it.

All that floaty teeter totter feeling to the car is gone. The nose dive and lift is gone. That vague feeling is gone, you can feel what the tires are doing much more. Turn in is amazing and it holds a corner far more than I would have thought possible.

As far as NVH don't worry about the springs and shocks it's minimal. What will give you some NVH is the upper control arm. If you can remove the wheel hop with just the lowers then you might want to skip the upper if NVH is an issue. Also you will get a little NVH with a short throw shifter if you do that mod, not much though.

In all I would say if the Koni's are on sale still then you should jump on it. If nothing else get the sports now and the rest later. I think the combo of springs shocks and camber plates might put you just over your budget, but not by much.

 

[Sky Render]

Get Konis, Steeda springs, an adjustable panhard bar, and something to readjust camber. Boom. Done.

Eibach stuff sucks unless you're getting their high-end coilovers. Even then, there are better options for the money.

i gotta meet some of you guys in real life and try out your rides =]

No one gets to touch my car unless they are female, hot, and mostly naked.

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[Sleeper_08]

Did you see this sticky from above

http://mustangforums.com/forum/s197-handling-section/614252-this-is-why-shocks-matter.html

 

[martin_nj]

Did you see this sticky from above

http://mustangforums.com/forum/s197-handling-section/614252-this-is-why-shocks-matter.html

that link isn't working for me

No one gets to touch my car unless they are female, hot, and mostly naked.

who says i want to touch it? i'm just going to sit passenger while you demo it for me .... i can be as naked as you want

I recently did the suspension on my 2012 brembo gt.

thank you morris that is a sweet in -depth write up... any reason you didn't consider sway bars?

 

[Morris]

I have..........considered the sway bars that is, but when I asked Mr. Strano about sway bars in another post his reply was "Just put the stuff on". I seem to have a difficult time conversing with him on the phone so I was not inclined to call him again. I left it at that and did like he said.

The car handles well, far beyond the limits of the public roads. So until I hit the tracks and find it lacking in some way I'm good with the way it is. Keep in mind that I have a Brembo car and I think that it does come with a some what larger sway bar set up that the standard GT.

 

[frank s]

... Keep in mind that I have a Brembo car and I think that it does come with a some what larger sway bar set up that the standard GT.

I think it would be worthwhile to find out for certain whether or not the Brembo car comes with a somewhat larger sway bar setup than the standard.

Seems to me there is a list of S197 sway bar specifications out there, but I haven't been able to find it. Please post the results of your search.

 

[SoundGuyDave]

@soundguydave - can you describe how it feels around town, over bumps, rail road tracks, rough surfaces?

Weeelllll, not so great. That, however, is a function of the setup on the dampers and the spring rates chosen for what I do with the car, which is a pure track toy. I posted that vid not to suggest what you should put on the car, but as an example of exactly what uprated springs and dampers can do for you. The package I have on the car is well beyond your budget constraints, and neither Sam nor myself would necessarily recommend that setup for a street-driven car. I have plenty of time in Koni/Steeda Sport equipped cars, and they feel quite nice on the track, and with a twist of the adjusters, can be softened up for street duty. It's a good, proven combo.

Personally, I would recommend the Koni Sports, Steeda Sport springs, and Maximum Motorsports camber/caster plates. The total will punch through your budget ceiling, but not by all that much, and is probably the best bang for the buck out there. Like a number of us have mentioned, call Sam Strano, he'll give you the right stuff for what you want to do with the car.

 

[Fuerte]

Personally, I would recommend the Koni Sports, Steeda Sport springs, and Maximum Motorsports camber/caster plates. The total will punch through your budget ceiling, but not by all that much, and is probably the best bang for the buck out there. Like a number of us have mentioned, call Sam Strano, he'll give you the right stuff for what you want to do with the car.

I went with close to the same set up expect for the springs I went with sportlines. Around town it feels as comfertable as stock and less body body roll

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[Thekid760]

I agree with most. Get new springs/struts, fix the rearend elignment and camber. Bolt that crap on and drive it for awhile. Then go from there. With a goos shock/strut setup, you wont miss not upgrading sway bars on the street.

I still have stock sways and with my KW's it handles amazingly with tons of adjustment. I realize those are out of the price range you listed which is why I didn't recommend them.

 

[Norm Peterson]

i would like to improve its transitions. i haven't had it on track yet but on the street

1) the dive and squat makes it harder to give it quick inputs and have the car ready for your next command.. how to explain it - you ask it to brake it does so but then asks you to wait while the body finishes the braking/diving.

2) on the highway emergency lane change maneuvers really don't inspire confidence.


i do realize i will have to drive this car a bit differently and i don't want to turn this into a go-kart per se... but i do want to get the body roll under control (and hopefully not lower my overall grip traction)

Funny, I never felt that the highway speed emergency maneuvering was particularly deficient (and I have a 65 mph 3-cone slalom maneuver around bits of a disintegrated truck tire as basis for opinion).

Fact is, the car will turn in better than you can stay planted in your seat if your seating surfaces are leather ("leather"?).

I guess roll and pitch motions bother some people more than others, or at the very least don't upset some driving "styles" as much as others. "Slow hands" does not have to mean "glacial", but probably does suggest something about how fast you should be dialing in however much steering you need.


Anyway, for a car that's ever going to be tracked or otherwise driven unusually hard, you want the Koni Sports/yellows. The next step up as far as dampers are concerned will blow your budget before you get all four.

For springs, Steeda Sports at just over 1" lower seem to be preferred. Other than suggesting that the rear suspension geometry starts going away as you lower much more than that, I can't speak directly about them as I'm still on the OE springs. (Yes, I get a LOT of tail rise/nose dive under hard braking, but from behind the wheel I hardly notice it and even from pictures it doesn't bother me enough to hurry this part of the mod program up and get involved with subsequent geometry fixes).

At least eventually, adjustable sta-bars should probably be part of the program.


Don't overlook upgrading the tires and wheels, and setting a more aggressive set of alignment specs. At least 9.5" wide wheels all around with the summer performance tires of your choice (the alignment part is free if you can DIY it).


Norm

 

[Norm Peterson]

I don't think my Mustang ever rolls much more than what this thumbnail shows. I'm not quite to the point where I can feed in much throttle without compromising my line through the next couple of course features, so it's pretty close to a max steady-state cornering shot. Camber looks OK (it's set at about -1.8° static), and it seems to take a set quickly enough.

There's a difference between making 'quick inputs' and being late getting them started. Autocross slaloming can teach you that it takes a finite amount of time to get the wheel steered from straight ahead (or turned the other way) to wherever it needs to be to negotiate the upcoming turn. During that time, you travel a finite distance down course, so it only makes sense to get your turning started a little sooner so that you get the right amount of steering dialed in at the right time. IOW, don't react, anticipate. This goes to teaching your hands to be slow (and generally move the least amount necessary) and is probably good practice even in street driving.


Norm