Crankshaft thrust bearings

[86GT351]

As i see it if i will use a stock bore than i won’t need machine work. The hone in the sleeves looks very good. Even if i will need to rehone it, it doesn’t cost that much here. One of a few advantages living in Ukraine is labour price. But it has also downsides, because you got payed less money too lol!

Understood

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

Does someone has any experience with this Eagle stroker kit:

Ford 3V 4.6L-300 Eagle Street & Strip Stroker Kit (16414000)

3.750" Cast Crank, 5.950" H-BEAM Rods,3/8" ARP 8740 BOLTS,Forged 2618 ARIAS -19CC INVERTED DOME 3.572" PISTONS, PLASMA-MOLY FILE-FIT RINGS,CLEVITE P Rod/MAIN BEARINGS.

www.cleggengine.com

The price seems not that high, and i understand that that comes from the cheap cast crankshaft itself.

 

[Midlife Crises]

Just a few thoughts. It’s entirely possible you will need to clean up the bore for new pistons and rings. Most common overbore is 0.020” over. You can always see the old crosshatch on the cylinder walls so that means nothing. The cast crank is probably OK and the P series bearings are for standard service. Who made the rods? This is important. Also, if you use ARP fasteners you want ARP 2,000. What compression do the Arias pistons yield and the moly faced rings are not used much these days. Low tension stainless steel or alloy steel and even gapless rings are used most often.

 

[Juice]

I would pull a cam bearing cap or two before anyfhing. If there is damage, which is bad by itself, there is metal that got into oil passeges, you are pretty much commited to a full disassembly.

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

I would pull a cam bearing cap or two before anyfhing. If there is damage, which is bad by itself, there is metal that got into oil passeges, you are pretty much commited to a full disassembly.

Good thought, thanks. Old oil was full of metal, you could clearly see it with the flashlight.

 

[Juice]

Good thought, thanks. Old oil was full of metal, you could clearly see it with the flashlight.

Enough metal in there, it will wreak havoc with cam sensors. Plug up the vvt solenoids etc. Check engine light forever, or worse.

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

Enough metal in there, it will wreak havoc with cam sensors. Plug up the vvt solenoids etc. Check engine light forever, or worse.

My phasers are locked out and disabled in the tune, so i need to take a closer look to the heads, because they could really be clogged, or cam caps could be scored. Thanks for wise good advise!

 

[brasil]

...buy a good used engine. And never look back. You are burning money...
As I said.. your old engine is dead . Too much issues...

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

...buy a good used engine. And never look back. You are burning money...
As I said.. your old engine is dead . Too much issues...

Maybe you are right... I'm still doing my math now, trying to understand what will be best to do for the money. The fastest route will be buying used engine for $2500 for sure.

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

Maybe you are right... I'm still doing my math now, trying to understand what will be best to do for the money. The fastest route will be buying used engine for $2500 for sure.

That would be the wisest option to get you back on the road. You can then strip down your old engine at leisure to assess the damage and decide what's salvageable enough to keep as spare parts.

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

That would be the wisest option to get you back on the road. You can then strip down your old engine at leisure to assess the damage and decide what's salvageable enough to keep as spare parts.

Yes. The more i think about it, the more it seems to me like the only one right choice for now.

 

[Kev555]

Maybe you are right... I'm still doing my math now, trying to understand what will be best to do for the money. The fastest route will be buying used engine for $2500 for sure.

Ive just spent 3K on my stock engine refreshing it between engineering costs and parts and the crank etc was in good shape, so if you get an engine for 2.5K, seems like the best option.

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

Thanks everyone for the input. I’ve finally pulled the trigger on that long block. I hope that next week the shop will be able to swap it into my car. The only thing that scares me now is that i’m still not sure what exactly caused that damage to my thrust bearing. Could it be these shims that i’ve put under my slave cylinder?

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

Thanks everyone for the input. I’ve finally pulled the trigger on that long block. I hope that next week the shop will be able to swap it into my car. The only thing that scares me now is that i’m still not sure what exactly caused that damage to my thrust bearing. Could it be these shims that i’ve put under my slave cylinder?

Yes it's possible you could have put too much shim thickness under the slave cylinder.

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

Yes it's possible you could have put too much shim thickness under the slave cylinder.

Understood. I wonder now, maybe i shouldn’t put any shims at all this time? I did put the shims because i had a problem with my clutch, it didn’t fully disengage. The problem was in the master cylinder, but when i understood it was too late and the damage was done.

 

[Juice]

Thanks everyone for the input. I’ve finally pulled the trigger on that long block. I hope that next week the shop will be able to swap it into my car. The only thing that scares me now is that i’m still not sure what exactly caused that damage to my thrust bearing. Could it be these shims that i’ve put under my slave cylinder?

I seriously doubt the shim caused that damage. Its actually not that uncommon of a failure on high milage engines.I had an old 289 with auto, that engine had about a 1/4" crank endplay. Yes 0.250"
All it takes is one short period of oil starvation to score the bearing surface, and it will eat itself after. Or possible some oil contamination.
As far as shimming the slave, you are shimming it so it will not over-extend and fall apart. That's the only reason. Shimming only moves the slave piston's travel, will not change pedal engagement.

Lightbulb moment: you shimmed to get a better pedal. I think the clutch is worn and needs replaced, a new friction disk at minimum. A worn clutch requires higher effort, which WILL put more pressure on the crank thrust. hmmmmmm

 

[brasil]

shimming the slave ( as I understand correctly ) is very special thing. needs to be within a specific range. Too much shims..and the TOB comes "out too far - result extreme force on the clutch..towards the crank. on the other side..not enough shims.. and we run into the risk of "popping "out the slave piston from the bore.

So... the question is - how deep the piston is still sitting inside the Slave bore ? I would prefer to save my crank ..

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

shimming the slave ( as I understand correctly ) is very special thing. needs to be within a specific range. Too much shims..and the TOB comes "out too far - result extreme force on the clutch..towards the crank. on the other side..not enough shims.. and we run into the risk of "popping "out the slave piston from the bore.

So... the question is - how deep the piston is still sitting inside the Slave bore ? I would prefer to save my crank ..

I think i had this shim kit:

Slave Cylinder Shim Kit (3 Pack)

During each and every clutch install you perform on a newer GM vehicle, you must measure to see if a shim is necessary for proper installation.

www.tickperformance.com

I've put two shims under my slave cylinder: one 0.180" and one 0.113". After that my engaging point on the clutch pedal had changed dramatically, but the clutch still couldn't completely disengage, especially in hot weather. I think that i've moved my slave cylinder forward towards the crankshaft too much and this caused thrust bearing damage. But who knows... Since the first day i bought my car back in the 2020 it has been burning about one quart of oil on 1k miles. Also my 5R55S died in January, maybe before that torque converter also made some pressure to the crank. Maybe all this contributed to that damage, i guess we'll never know. I won't put any shims behind my slave cylinder this time, i hope that this new to me engine will then be going strong. But if he dies, he dies lol.

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

I seriously doubt the shim caused that damage. Its actually not that uncommon of a failure on high milage engines.I had an old 289 with auto, that engine had about a 1/4" crank endplay. Yes 0.250"
All it takes is one short period of oil starvation to score the bearing surface, and it will eat itself after. Or possible some oil contamination.
As far as shimming the slave, you are shimming it so it will not over-extend and fall apart. That's the only reason. Shimming only moves the slave piston's travel, will not change pedal engagement.

Lightbulb moment: you shimmed to get a better pedal. I think the clutch is worn and needs replaced, a new friction disk at minimum. A worn clutch requires higher effort, which WILL put more pressure on the crank thrust. hmmmmmm

I shimmed my slave cylinder because i thought that i will get a better pedal. But in fact it didn't help, only changed engaging point. Then i bought a 2013-2014 GT500 master cylinder and it finally helped, but by the time i've changed it my crankshaft already had too much of end play and the catastrophic damage to my engine already had been done.

 

[brasil]

... if I were you. I would use the GT500 master, with a stock clutch LUK / SACHS /VALEO.. with the green TOB. I think this ia good combo. I am not a friend of HD clutches .. for Stock or close to stock engines... ( but that is my own opinion ) I like it OEM / Bone stock.. - less headache mostly