2008 ROUSH Stage 3 Build...Take III

dysan

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Keep in mind when you have a coated piston, if you see any signs of detonation on your spark plugs when you check them the metal you see on them will be from the head first. Whatever metal is easiest to attack will be the first to go. Not saying this in a bad way, just something to mention just in case you see any signs of detonation in the future.
 

AutoXRacer

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What are the signs of detonation? I have not had any failures due to detonation.

Is it just metal particles on the tip and ground strap of the spark plug?
 

dysan

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Yes...tiny metal specs on the ground strap and porcelain of the plug. Just making you aware of this since my engine guy passed that info onto me with my last engine when it had the coated diamond pistons.
 

AutoXRacer

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Thanks!! How have those coated pistons been working out for you? Do they keep cleaner or does carbon still cake on top of them. Why did you go with coated pistons?
 

dysan

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I ended up having to thrown them out after less than a year on the engine. Damn $1500 set of custom pistons thrown in the trash(not their fault) Turns out the block I got was defective and by the end of the race season the entire driver's side of the block had out of round cylinders. The block itself was flexing. That's why I did an iron block for my current engine (built winter 2013-2014). I used manley flat top pistons in my current engine and it looked great after I took it out for maintenance this winter.
 

AutoXRacer

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Wow...

Let talk about pistons real quick... I noticed a difference between the JDM spec and the MMR spec...

Spoke with MMR and they said -6cc would maintain stock compression with their design.

I just noticed their (MMR) piston is different from the JDM version:

JDM 302E Manley Pistons:

DSC00352_zpscc1d925d.jpg


DSC00353_zps93709124.jpg


Versus the MMR/Manley:

mmrpiston_zpse8d648f1.jpg


Major difference I see is the top of the piston...

Any pros or cons to this design? I kind of tend to think the thicker radius around the MMR piston seems to make it look stronger.

I have no clue what compress ratio the ones pictured are. I will take pics of the ones I get for an even comparison.
 
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JoshK

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AutoXRacer, I too just order a set of the Manley/MMR pistons for my new engine. They were the only ones that had them in stock for the 3.800 stroke, and a big bore. I did not get mine coated, but they said they shipped yesterday. I should have them early next week.
 

05stroker

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That is a std Manley design with MMR on the top of the piston. I ran the 18cc dish pistons from Manley for a long time before going with flattops this last time. I hope you guys get what you asked for, it will be interesting to see if MMR cane deliver two orders without issue.
 
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JoshK

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Billy, I am fully aware of the bad rep MMR has. You can believe that with the 15+ emails that I sent MMR about these pistons before ordering I made damn good and sure it was "in writing" what I was expecting and ordering". I have saved all these emails and made them send me exact specs on the pistons before sending the money.
 

05stroker

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Billy, I am fully aware of the bad rep MMR has. You can believe that with the 15+ emails that I sent MMR about these pistons before ordering I made damn good and sure it was "in writing" what I was expecting and ordering". I have saved all these emails and made them send me exact specs on the pistons before sending the money.

From the sounds of it you guys had to go there to be able to get the 3.8 stroke pistons in stock.
 

Jkoogler

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Mine are also a 9.0:1 piston. Very nice piston. Mmr has nice parts just suck at assembling things.
 

JoshK

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Maybe not had to go there, probably could have called brenspeed but didn't think about till now.
 
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hamish

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Call L&M and get Michael to custom order some through diamond.
I think the picture on the company that shall not be named site is just a stock photo of different piston.
 
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one eyed willy

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-14cc manley "turbo" Pistons

60763BA5-8CE6-404E-B102-4CF3FBFC1200-410-00000023BD8C3BA3.jpg


That pic above is a much deeper dish. Mine came from Manley with coated skirts. When I was buying Pistons and talked to MMR, they don't have coated skirts on their Manley Pistons if you do their "coating". To me, I'm not expert but their "coating" was a turn off for me, they look more anodized to me to be pretty.....I think it's snake oil. That "coating" looks thin...to thin to do anything. Plus each time I called MMR, I'd get different info depending on who answered the phone.
 
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AutoXRacer

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Damn, you guys are making me paranoid. You are making me think I made a mistake.
 

JeremyH

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Mine are also a 9.0:1 piston. Very nice piston. Mmr has nice parts just suck at assembling things.

They don't make the pistons of course so as long as they don't fuck up your order and specs, or drop ship you an off the shelf piston, or send you the wrong bore... your good. All the things that are common for them on this board. My 2 cents, if your trying to get lucky at least go where you have decent odds in your favor.



Call L&M and get Michael to custom order some through diamond.
I think the picture on the company that shall not be named site is just a stock photo of different piston.

I will always use diamond, after having a motor built that's performed very well not a single hiccup and diamond being my engine builders first choice. For me its a no brainer.
 

JeremyH

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-14cc manley "turbo" Pistons



That pic above is a much deeper dish. Mine came from Manley with coated skirts. When I was buying Pistons and talked to MMR, they don't have coated skirts on their Manley Pistons if you do their "coating". To me, I'm not expert but their "coating" was a turn off for me, they look more anodized to me to be pretty.....I think it's snake oil. That "coating" looks thin...to thin to do anything. Plus each time I called MMR, I'd get different info depending on who answered the phone.




My view on piston coatings in general is snake oil. If its a race engine getting tore down in each season have at it. But for anything else its a waste of money. The coating will wear off and ends up in your cylinder or crankcase. Your run the risk of clearance and increased knock or slap over time as it wears down and get uneven heat buildup. The thicker the coating the more risk as it wears off so a thin coating may actual be idea. I have never used a coated piston nor would ever get one for my applications.


Thanks!! How have those coated pistons been working out for you? Do they keep cleaner or does carbon still cake on top of them. Why did you go with coated pistons?

A top coat provides a thermal barrier to keep heat in the combustion chamber, and no it does nothing to keep it cleaner and prevent carbon buildup. Also to note, as the coating wears down you will have areas where the piston is absorbing more heat which can cause distortion in the piston.


Keep in mind when you have a coated piston, if you see any signs of detonation on your spark plugs when you check them the metal you see on them will be from the head first. Whatever metal is easiest to attack will be the first to go. Not saying this in a bad way, just something to mention just in case you see any signs of detonation in the future.

I ended up having to thrown them out after less than a year on the engine. Damn $1500 set of custom pistons thrown in the trash(not their fault) Turns out the block I got was defective and by the end of the race season the entire driver's side of the block had out of round cylinders. The block itself was flexing. That's why I did an iron block for my current engine (built winter 2013-2014). I used manley flat top pistons in my current engine and it looked great after I took it out for maintenance this winter.

Another good point. I would want the pistons and cylinders absorbing as much heat as they can and evenly as they can and let the fuel and coolant absorb the heat out of the block, heads and combustion chamber, like its supposed to.


My bottom line if your looking for longevity skip the coatings and get a quality 2618 piston, and if your running higher compression and lift do 3v specific valve reliefs, that's my opinion.
 
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lito

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My view on piston coatings in general is snake oil. If its a race engine getting tore down in each season have at it. But for anything else its a waste of money. The coating will wear off and ends up in your cylinder or crankcase. Your run the risk of clearance and increased knock or slap over time as it wears down and get uneven heat buildup. The thicker the coating the more risk as it wears off so a thin coating may actual be idea. I have never used a coated piston nor would ever get one for my applications.




A top coat provides a thermal barrier to keep heat in the combustion chamber, and no it does nothing to keep it cleaner and prevent carbon buildup. Also to note, as the coating wears down you will have areas where the piston is absorbing more heat which can cause distortion in the piston.






Another good point. I would want the pistons and cylinders absorbing as much heat as they can and evenly as they can and let the fuel and coolant absorb the heat out of the block, heads and combustion chamber, like its supposed to.


My bottom line if your looking for longevity skip the coatings and get a quality 2618 piston, and if your running higher compression and lift do 3v specific valve reliefs, that's my opinion.

Coyote pistons are coated in stock form.
 

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