WE SHOULDN'T TALK ABOUT NOTHING BUT THE RPM ACT!!!!!

[Juice]

In regards to my particular situation as previously mentioned, it is fact, not just an opinion!



Actually, it was my local Ford dealership who installed my Saleen VI supercharger back in 2006. The dealership back then was also an official Saleen dealership as well. All parts installed from the Saleen VI supercharger kit include an "OEM" Saleen factory airbox lid which is 100% C.A.R.B certified and my PCM was also required to be sent to Saleen to be re-flashed with their calibration which is also C.A.R.B legal as well. If you look at my images? you'll notice the stock airbox is still in place with the "OEM" Saleen airbox lid. Therefore, technically speaking, no factory emissions equipment was ever removed lol. That being said, my vehicle meets all EPA and C.A.R.B EO# requirements.



You're exactly 100% spot on.



For those who can't afford a 2020/2021 GT500, Dodge Demon or whatever? there's always used 2007-14 GT500's and Dodge Challenger "Hellcats" that are more affordable.



If the said part included with the EO# replacement kit as in supercharger? then all parts related to that replacement kit are also EO# legal as well.

We also have the same 5k miles per year emissions exemption here in PA as well, however, the vehicle can technically fail visual inspection if any portion of the "OEM" catalyst equipment has been removed!

lol, yea Im in PA.
Seems that if there are cats, any cats on there, its fine for an exemption. No cats are a different story.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

Rhetorical Question:
Are there any cams with a Carb EO available for any modular fords or coyotes? Or intake manifolds-other than the whipple supercharger or the edelbrock TVS?

You may want to consider asking Livernois motorsports? As they claim to offer performance parts which are Carb EO compliant

lol, yea Im in PA.
Seems that if there are cats, any cats on there, its fine for an exemption. No cats are a different story.

Not necessarily! If the PA inspector happens to be a real dick about it? The vehicle can technically still fail visual inspection if the inspector can determine that the "OEM" catted mid-pipe has since been replaced with a non-OEM catted mid-pipe, regardless if the vehicle in question is emissions exempt or not. Although it's very rare, the vehicle can legally fail visual inspection, based upon the inspector's discretion.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

It would be great to have a list for emissions legal mods, and maybe even market a Thor parts AFTER the RPM Act becomes law


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's actually IF the RPM act becomes law

 

[Shaffe]

You may want to consider asking Livernois motorsports? As they claim to offer performance parts which are Carb EO compliant



Not necessarily! If the PA inspector happens to be a real dick about it? The vehicle can technically still fail visual inspection if the inspector can determine that the "OEM" catted mid-pipe has since been replaced with a non-OEM catted mid-pipe, regardless if the vehicle in question is emissions exempt or not. Although it's very rare, the vehicle can legally fail visual inspection, based upon the inspector's discretion.

Didn't feel like quoting both your posts but good info on the SC kit lol. Touche to that point that it's all on the up and up lol.

 

[RED09GT]

You may want to consider asking Livernois motorsports? As they claim to offer performance parts which are Carb EO compliant

If comp doesn't have an EO for those cams, neither will livernois. Livernois cams are rebranded comp stuff, some are ground on different LSA's but many of them are straight out of the box.
And I'm not shopping for emissions legal cams at this time (hence the rhetorical question) and since I'm in Canada, I give zero actual fucks about the EPA, I'm concerned about the damage the enforcement will do to the aftermarket.
And Livernois are some of the biggest snake oil salesmen in the game.

 

[Juice]

I dont feel the aftermarket will suffer much from this. Things will be different for sure, but it is too big a market to just kill it all off.
Maybe some dealerships will do more "authorized" mods.
Price of CARB certificationr will likely raise performace part prices. And the price level will stabilize eventually.

 

[StevezStang]

Here in middle Tennessee we have to still go through Marta and have our emissions okayed before we can receive our yearly registration. I live in Davidson County and all the counties that touch Davidson County in it’s perimeter still have to go thru Marta also. If it’s an outlying county then they are not required to participate.
It’s all total BS because when the majority of purchased autos reach a certain year the requirement to have cars tested should be totally eliminated as pollution is at minimum risk.
Florida has adopted these laws years ago but Tennessee hangs on to the requirement in order to get the extra revenue. Such a hassle if you really want to update the performance of your Mustang or muscle car and stay within required limits of epa restrictions!

 

[Shaffe]

I dont feel the aftermarket will suffer much from this. Things will be different for sure, but it is too big a market to just kill it all off.
Maybe some dealerships will do more "authorized" mods.
Price of CARB certificationr will likely raise performace part prices. And the price level will stabilize eventually.

I feel like that is where we disagree. Anytime the govt gets involved in something they over complicate it.

The CARB compliant cats is a perfect example, technically they meet all requirements and should be no problem however it is illegal to remove a functioning cat. So even though one might be carb complaint, if there is nothing wrong with the factory one it would be illegal to replace it.

This reminds me of the assault weapons ban from the 90s. Most of the things they used to define an assault weapon were purely cosmetic. Example a Ruger Mini 14 in wood trim wasn't banned because it didn't have a pistol grip or retractable stock. Despite it using the same magazines, ammo as the AR-15s that were banned.

 

[Juice]

I just purchased AM cats. According to Flowmaster, there are 3 possibilities where it is legal to install AM cats.
Failed, missing, and I cant recall the third, sorry. lol
They also state that the use of those 3way cats will keep the CEL off.
This does not mean that they are actually OK to use on a street car, but it sounds like it is still a grey area.

 

[tjm73]

The CARB compliant cats is a perfect example, technically they meet all requirements and should be no problem however it is illegal to remove a functioning cat. So even though one might be carb complaint, if there is nothing wrong with the factory one it would be illegal to replace it.

Honest. My whole mid-pipe got crushed when a Harbor Freight jack stand failed. Thank God I had rolled out from under the car to get a wrench when it fell. Anyway, since it was damaged pretty bad, I went ahead and replaced it with this CARB certified replacements setup. I scrapped the damaged pipe or you could see how messed up it was. So we're good?

 

[eighty6gt]

Perjury is a crime. Elon musk is working on mind reading technology that will also be required to live in usa

 

[Juice]

Perjury is a crime. Elon musk is working on mind reading technology that will also be required to live in usa

I will have none of that! My mind is the last private & unmonitored space remaining!

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

Didn't feel like quoting both your posts but good info on the SC kit lol. Touche to that point that it's all on the up and up lol.

Put it this way, it's all on the up and up for now.. However, if the EPA regulations become more strict? what's considered as all on the up and up at present might not be necessarily down the road

If comp doesn't have an EO for those cams, neither will livernois. Livernois cams are rebranded comp stuff, some are ground on different LSA's but many of them are straight out of the box.
And I'm not shopping for emissions legal cams at this time (hence the rhetorical question) and since I'm in Canada, I give zero actual fucks about the EPA, I'm concerned about the damage the enforcement will do to the aftermarket.
And Livernois are some of the biggest snake oil salesmen in the game.

Hence, you asked a rhetorical question and were provided with a rhetorical answer. Enough said!

 

[Pentalab]

In regards to my particular situation as previously mentioned, it is fact, not just an opinion!



Actually, it was my local Ford dealership who installed my Saleen VI supercharger back in 2006. The dealership back then was also an official Saleen dealership as well. All parts installed from the Saleen VI supercharger kit include an "OEM" Saleen factory airbox lid which is 100% C.A.R.B certified and my PCM was also required to be sent to Saleen to be re-flashed with their calibration which is also C.A.R.B legal as well. If you look at my images? you'll notice the stock airbox is still in place with the "OEM" Saleen airbox lid. Therefore, technically speaking, no factory emissions equipment was ever removed lol. That being said, my vehicle meets all EPA and C.A.R.B EO# requirements.



You're exactly 100% spot on.



For those who can't afford a 2020/2021 GT500, Dodge Demon or whatever? there's always used 2007-14 GT500's and Dodge Challenger "Hellcats" that are more affordable.



If the said part included with the EO# replacement kit as in supercharger? then all parts related to that replacement kit are also EO# legal as well.

We also have the same 5k miles per year emissions exemption here in PA as well, however, the vehicle can technically fail visual inspection if any portion of the "OEM" catalyst equipment has been removed!

Your oem 2006 airbox is 2 steps below semi useless. The oem 05-09 airboxes do not flow very well to begin with, even with a K+N panel filter installed. LT's are just 'free hp + tq'. High flow cats are more efficient vs oem cats since hi flow cats are bigger diam, like 4". The bigger diam cats provides for more parallel paths... = less back pressure + greater/ faster flow.

Per the EPA nonsense, the car could be belching out all sorts of crap.... but as long as it passes some 'readiness test' on the OBD port.... then it's all..."ok".

 

[LikeabossTM]

I feel like that is where we disagree. Anytime the govt gets involved in something they over complicate it.

The CARB compliant cats is a perfect example, technically they meet all requirements and should be no problem however it is illegal to remove a functioning cat. So even though one might be carb complaint, if there is nothing wrong with the factory one it would be illegal to replace it.

This reminds me of the assault weapons ban from the 90s. Most of the things they used to define an assault weapon were purely cosmetic. Example a Ruger Mini 14 in wood trim wasn't banned because it didn't have a pistol grip or retractable stock. Despite it using the same magazines, ammo as the AR-15s that were banned.

This strikes me as a ridiculous law. Or, it's been misinterpreted. I believe that it's likely the former and shake my head.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

Your oem 2006 airbox is 2 steps below semi useless. The oem 05-09 airboxes do not flow very well to begin with, even with a K+N panel filter installed. LT's are just 'free hp + tq'. High flow cats are more efficient vs oem cats since hi flow cats are bigger diam, like 4". The bigger diam cats provides for more parallel paths... = less back pressure + greater/ faster flow.

Per the EPA nonsense, the car could be belching out all sorts of crap.... but as long as it passes some 'readiness test' on the OBD port.... then it's all..."ok".

First off, only the bottom portion is from the stock airbox, which btw: has also been modified by cutting out the bottom section. The upper portion is the "OEM" Saleen airbox lid with integrated 98mm MAF that was also on the 2007-2009 Saleen Extreme S281 production models which support up to 600 RWHP. Perhaps your assuming the upper portion of the Saleen airbox lid is the same as the OEM 05-09 Mustang GT airbox? however, it clearly is not.

 

[Pentalab]

First off, only the bottom portion is from the stock airbox, which btw: has also been modified by cutting out the bottom section. The upper portion is the "OEM" Saleen airbox lid with integrated 98mm MAF that was also on the 2007-2009 Saleen Extreme S281 production models which support up to 600 RWHP. Perhaps your assuming the upper portion of the Saleen airbox lid is the same as the OEM 05-09 Mustang GT airbox? however, it clearly is not.

If u chopped a huge hole in the bottom of the oem airbox, you just took out a huge restriction. How do u get cold air INTO the oem airbox.... from the eng bay ?

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

If u chopped a huge hole in the bottom of the oem airbox, you just took out a huge restriction. How do u get cold air INTO the oem airbox.... from the eng bay ?

I went ahead and attached a link for the Saleen series VI 475HP S/C manual kit. Just scroll to page#15 and you'll notice from fig#21 and fig#22 how they cut an opening in the bottom of the stock airbox. It's not really that big of an opening, just enough to allow cooler air in from underneath the vehicle, much in the same way as the Saleen extreme/ultimate 95mm CAI is designed with an open airbox bottom . https://www.soec.org/manuals/supercharger/mustang/10-8002-C14338C.pdf

 

[Shaffe]

This strikes me as a ridiculous law. Or, it's been misinterpreted. I believe that it's likely the former and shake my head.

This is taken from American Muscle in the Q&A on a midpipe

"The Magnaflow Catted Tru-X X-Pipe (05-09 GT) is not CARB legal, so it will not pass emissions in California. As for other states, this should pass. But, legally you cannot swap a catalytic converter unless it is proven to be defective."

The way I read that is even though the pipe in this example is not CARB legal, it is technically illegal regardless to swap out a functioning catalytic converter.

My exhaust guy told me the same thing when I had my X pipe installed on my 07 GT. Told me legally I can't do this but he did it anyways because he knew my dad from back in the day and I paid him cash so it was off the books.

 

[ACME RACING TEAM]

I'm not even sure how this RPM act applies here. We are not turning our street cars into race cars with modding.

The problem comes when people try to pass off "race cars" as "street cars" . . . This really started, back when "Pro Street" first came out, in the 1980's.

Removing cats, using "emulators" to fool computers into thinking the car is still smog-legal, Loud, obnoxious, raspy exhaust systems that call way too much attention to "street cars", etc . . .

Now, combine that with street-racing, drifting in parking lots, bass-booming stereo's, "coal-rolling", and other activities that get the attention of Law Enforcement.

All of that puts "mildly-modded" cars under unwanted scrutiny. Eventually, they will crack down and "hot-rodding" will die a painful death.